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Old 06-24-2013, 02:28 PM   #16
ronaldvalente
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chocological View Post
The liquid CO2 stuff has an algaecide in it. Anacharis will melt with it.
And I'll quote Tom Barr here.
Interesting, so if I stop dosing Excel… the may help the Anacharis. I am under the impression that I am diffusing CO2 properly into the tank.

It starts 1 hour before the lights come on, then turns off 1 hour before they shut off.

Right now, I have a controller that runs the light (and subsequently the CO2) based on the season. Right now I am averaging around 8 hours of both light and CO2 per day. Is that incorrect?
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Old 06-24-2013, 02:30 PM   #17
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yikes, good thing i stopped using it then!

as for gravel vac, i never vac by pushing it into the substrate. i just kinda hover over the plants and substrate to suck up any loose dead leaves and such. i leave mulm alone since that'll be future fertilizer for the plants. if i'm really quick, i'll shake the plants a bit with tweezers when doing the vac, to get some detrius loose, but that's as far as i go.
Ok, that is exactly what I do as well. Root growth has been fairly good in Eco-Complete. I would love to try Aqua Soil, but I don't want to drop too much [more] money into this until I find the root cause.
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Old 06-24-2013, 02:33 PM   #18
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oh, you've been dosing excel as well as injecting CO2? i thought about doing that since i thought "hey, more carbon the better, right?" but i noticed that my plants did better after stopping the CO2 booster and sticking just with the pressurized CO2.

come to think of it, i got some java moss in that had some bad black beard algae all over it. i dosed it with CO2 booster and wiped it all off, but the moss browned up and died. i guess too much of a good thing is a bad thing. i did some reading just now on the algaecide in excel - using excel in spot applications to treat bad algae outbreaks is ok, but too much exposure can do a number on plants too!

speaking of roots, i use root tabs in eco-complete since eco itself doesn't have nutrients in it. i just poke a tab into the substrate next to the roots and that's it.
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Old 06-24-2013, 02:47 PM   #19
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I'd double up on the dosing and lengthen the day rather than cut back. Elodea is a fast growing weed and nutrient hogs. GSA is an indicator of low phosphate and probably low CO2. Your light isn't particularly bright for the tank, I would keep it at 8 hours or increase a bit to see if that help. I would dose more for a couple weeks to see if things improve then change the light period rather than do it all at once.

Check the actual pH of the water before CO2 goes on, just as the lights go on and when the drop checker is finally showing yellow. The last two should be nearly the same, the first should be at its highest point and the same as if you dipped out a cup of tank water and left it for 24 hours. If the second pH is much lower than the third either increase the flow around your diffuser or turn the CO2 on earlier. Your setup seems fine to me and your CO2 is getting around the tank fine though. Do you have a nice ripple on the surface? You can increase the CO2 delivered if O2 is in good supply.

I put a sprig of hornwort, an infamous weed, in the tank a few months ago. My tank has been up since October and has lots of nutrients, CO2 and light and plants grow pretty fast and mostly algae free. It looked horrible for a couple weeks. New growth happened but it turned brown pretty fast. After about a month it finally adjusted and today I am going to weigh what is in the tank after 4 days growth. Started with 50 grams, looks like at least 100 and possibly more today. Keep at it, the plants could still be in adjustment phase.

As for the cleaning crew otos are great. I figure there are lots of different kinds of grazing critters and have 4 different mouth styles in the tank. Snails, platies, otos and bristlenose plecos. Shrimp and snails would be good but with the fish load it is unlikely they would be able to do much before they become a tasty meal. Angels nibble at algae, don't know if loaches or gouramis do or not.

Try to grow healthy plants rather than eliminate algae though. Fertilizer is and light may need to be increased to get that and grazers are a help but don't count on them to polish the tank clean.
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Old 06-24-2013, 02:54 PM   #20
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Kathyy - thanks so much for the detail! I have a nice ripple from the Eheim spray bars.
(I have both of them submerged, one pointed far and a slight angle, and one points at a steeper angle).

Couple of questions based on your reply...

- Would you increase micro and macro evenly or just up the macro?
- Should I skip a week of water changes to keep the ferts higher for a little longer?
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:10 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronaldvalente View Post
Yes, liquid form.

I am using this setup: http://greenleafaquariums.com/aquari...r-package.html

With these directions: http://blog.greenleafaquariums.com/2...just-mix-dose/

Macro: In 500 ml Bottle #1
K2SO4 – 29 grams
KNO3 – 33 grams
KH2PO4 – 3 grams
MgSO4 – 20 grams
That isn't a good mix for a macro fertilizer - way too little phosphate (KH2PO4). It would be better to have about 3 or 4 times as much KH2PO4. Without adequate phosphate, the plants can't grow fast enough to use up the KNO3.
Quote:

Micro: In 500 ml Bottle #2
Plantex CSM+B – 40 grams

I change the water Bi-Weekly.

Thanks OVT!
One way to fertilize is to follow the dosages in http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=21944 where the proportions of KNO3 and KH2PO4 are 4 parts KNO3 to 1 part KH2PO4, and I actually find that it works better for me if I double the amount of KH2PO4.
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Old 06-24-2013, 11:05 PM   #22
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That isn't a good mix for a macro fertilizer - way too little phosphate (KH2PO4). It would be better to have about 3 or 4 times as much KH2PO4. Without adequate phosphate, the plants can't grow fast enough to use up the KNO3.
One way to fertilize is to follow the dosages in http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=21944 where the proportions of KNO3 and KH2PO4 are 4 parts KNO3 to 1 part KH2PO4, and I actually find that it works better for me if I double the amount of KH2PO4.
Thanks Hoppy, I am looking at the PPS-Pro Google Page right now:
https://sites.google.com/site/aquati...r/home/pps-pro

For a 500ml bottle it says to create the following solution:

Macro
K2SO4 - 29g
KNO3 - 33g
KH2PO4 - 3g
MgSO4 - 20g

Micro
TE - 40g

That is verbatim to what I am doing. I will dig around on the internet for other PPS-Pro recipes. Thanks again!
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Old 07-14-2013, 06:54 PM   #23
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Sooo I have been working on stabilizing everything and the water is becoming cloudy.
Not sure what I can do here to save this tank… any tips?

After it started getting clouding a did a gravel vac and 25% water change.

Thanks,
Ron
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Old 07-14-2013, 06:56 PM   #24
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Is it worth looking into a UV sterilizer?

The good news here is my biofilter caught up and we are back in business with crystal clear water.

Last edited by ronaldvalente; 07-21-2013 at 11:37 AM.. Reason: Added Resolution.
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Old 07-21-2013, 11:36 AM   #25
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Ok so I am unhappy with Eco-Complete as well. So I am planning on re-doing the entire tank. In its current state, would you try and save the plants and hardscape? or start completely over?

Substrate Help: Aqua Soil? Regular Garden Soil + Osmocote? Sand?

Last edited by ronaldvalente; 07-21-2013 at 11:36 AM.. Reason: Added Substrate Help
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Old 07-21-2013, 02:32 PM   #26
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I have eco complete in my 20g, and I've no issues. People grow plants in play sand.
What's the issue with your substrate?
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Old 07-21-2013, 02:55 PM   #27
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Don't blame the substrate. I use Eco complete in all my tanks. Over 2 years. No issues. I ei dose. Pressurized co2 and high light.



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Old 07-21-2013, 09:54 PM   #28
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Don't blame the substrate. I use Eco complete in all my tanks. Over 2 years. No issues. I ei dose. Pressurized co2 and high light.



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Not blaming the substrate, I am just more or less frustrated with my high tech setup. I know that it is me. Do you dose root tabs with your Eco Complete?
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Old 07-22-2013, 03:40 AM   #29
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I used to put in root tabs but I have stopped since everything is growing nicely. That was a year ago with root tabs.

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Old 07-22-2013, 04:09 AM   #30
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Isn't it logical to wonder if PPS Pro fertilizing is working for you? That's something I would do. When PPS was started it was assumed that phosphate should be kept as low as possible to avoid algae. We now know, and have known for over 10 years, that phosphate doesn't cause algae in an aquarium. So, at least one of the basic assumptions in PPS isn't correct.
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