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Old 02-20-2013, 04:35 PM   #1
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Help understanding cross breeding


If you have crs/CBS together you could have either one come out...

Yet everywhere seems to say if shrimp cross breed you get brown shrimp.

So greens came from yellows. If they are In the same tank won't it just be 50/50 chance if its green or yellow?

Blue velvets came from Rilli shrimp. I have seen blue and red rillis so wouldn't that happen from putting blue velvets and red rillis together?
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Old 02-20-2013, 05:01 PM   #2
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I'm into mutations myself, so let me answer what I can:

"If you have crs/CBS together you could have either one come out..."

Yepper. Since red is recessive to black in most crystal strains, you could have either appear.

"Yet everywhere seems to say if shrimp cross breed you get brown shrimp."


If you are talking about brown crystals, then that's where co-genes take place to provide the brown. Gets real complicated real fast on this.

However you may be mixing your shrimp species by saying brown shrimp. If you are talking about mixing colors in neos, yes- most times they revert back to wild colored shrimp.

"So greens came from yellows. If they are In the same tank won't it just be 50/50 chance if its green or yellow?"

Not sure where you found green came from yellows (?)

"Blue velvets came from Rilli shrimp. I have seen blue and red rillis so wouldn't that happen from putting blue velvets and red rillis together? "

Red rili is a type of shrimp that has produced both Blue rili, and blue velvet. Both look the same, however have different genetics.

Blue rili has been bred from red rilis with blue tissue, to have less and less red until you wind up with an all blue shrimp. That's not what breeders originally wanted with a blue rili, however that is what we have most recognizable now.

Blue velvet is a mutation that causes the red to fade away leaving just blue tissue.
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Old 02-20-2013, 05:04 PM   #3
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ok the thing is if you mix neos you will in general be undoing all the years of work that was put into creating the colors there are now. i myself put yellows and oranges together and what comes out of that or for my any way was yellow orange shrimp, little darker yellow than what i started with and lighter orange than what i started with so i didnt get browns from them. if you cross rili with blue velvets you will undo all the hard work it was to creat a solid blue shrimp and they will start looking like rili again. green and yellow are not generaly the same breed of shrimp. most green that are sold are not neos like the yellow. what happens is if you mix them all together over time you will get the wild colored shrimp ie brown, and what has happened is they have lost all the color that has been worked to get. as for rili and blue rili that are not blue velvets yes, my red rili is how i ended up with my blue shrimp but the blue velvets are a much better blue for the most part and breed true, my blues that came from my rili do not breed tru i can get blue, an aqua color blue, blue with red marking, red rili, and what i call purples due to the tint of the flesh.
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Old 02-20-2013, 05:09 PM   #4
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Cross breeding is between 2 different species.

Breeding color phenotypes is different entirely. If a color comes from another color, aka orange coming from pfr, pfr coming from Sakura coming from cherry, cherry from natural. You can breed all of those together without getting brown shrimp (except breeding natural to one of them). But let's say you mix a blue neo which comes from chocolate which comes from natural color, with an orange, it will make brown, because they each have a fundamentally separate coloration gene.
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Old 02-20-2013, 05:49 PM   #5
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So a mix of CBS and CRS produces a 50/50 mix of red and black, or is it skewed towards blacks?
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Old 02-20-2013, 05:55 PM   #6
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It's skewed to red, since the red gene is recessive, and when both parents have the recessive gene (which many cbs have as well) it's around 75 percent red offspring.
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:01 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mordalphus View Post
It's skewed to red, since the red gene is recessive, and when both parents have the recessive gene (which many cbs have as well) it's around 75 percent red offspring.
If it is skewed towards red, wouldn't that make the black a recessive gene and red the dominant gene?

In human blood types, for example, O is recessive. Therefore, the only way to have O blood is to have an O gene from each of your parents. My mother is an O. My dad is an A. I am an A but I know I must be an AO, not an AA because my mom is an O. My brother, on the other hand, is an O because my dad, like me, is an AO.
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:05 PM   #8
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I'm pretty sure mord just got the wording mixed up while he was typing. Yes, 75% CBS, 25% CRS (if both cbs have crs recessive.)
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:41 PM   #9
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Default Help understanding cross breeding

Well I have CBS and crs in one tank. No breeding yet. And a few red rill in another. In thinking of adding the blue velvets (came from rillis) with the rills. And depending who mates in thinking ill end up with all blue. Red blue or a mix. I could keep them separate but a guy can only have so many tanks haha.
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:54 PM   #10
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Mord didn't really mess up, the point he was making is that most CBS are diluted with red genes now. If you took a CBS with no red genes or exposed to red, then yes a CBS x CRS would give 100% CBS first generation as black is dominant and red is recessive, so all the babies would be black but red carriers. Then is further generations of those breeding, you would get 25% black double dominant, 50% black with red genes, 25% red. This is a perfect genetic world, which only applies over averages and time.

The main point though is that most CBS has red genes in them already as they have been kept with CRS for the past 10 years.
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Old 02-20-2013, 07:43 PM   #11
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Correct, all cbs now available have been mixed with red sometime in the past therefore the majority of s are carriers of the recessive gene that makes red
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Old 02-20-2013, 09:05 PM   #12
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Default Help understanding cross breeding

So crs and CBS are safe to love together. Is there any other known compatible mixes?

For neos would it be safe to mix blue velvets with my red rills or is it best to stick with just red rillis
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Old 02-20-2013, 09:21 PM   #13
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You could mix blue velvet with red rili, since the blue velvets come from red rili ancestor.

But there is no reason to do that unless that's what you want is some red rili, some blue rili and some blue velvet. Because none of them will breed true after they mix
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Old 02-20-2013, 09:26 PM   #14
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Default Help understanding cross breeding

Sounds like maybe I should just stock with the red rillis for now
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