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Old 01-13-2013, 09:37 PM   #16
DarkCobra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danielt View Post
All I know is BGA turns off because of the high nitrates.
Then dump in a lot of nitrate. You know exactly how much you're adding. If this turns BGA off, then it no longer depletes nitrate. In a high-light, heavily planted tank, plants typically use about 1-2ppm daily; if you have fish, food can easily add that back in and more. You're assured to reach at least your goal, no test kits necessary at all. If what you say is true, then this should be a surefire and foolproof cure, 100% of the time.

Look beyond your personal experiences to the many reported on this forum, and you will see this is clearly not the case.

This coming from someone who has had multiple BGA infestations, in tanks with heavy fish loads and EI dosing. Though I don't know my exact nitrate levels at the time of each infestation, I can say with certainty they were always excessively high, certainly high enough to "turn off" BGA immediately if that were possible. Yet it exploded each time I introduced an infected plant, effectively treatable only with antibiotics. It was only later, when both my skills and overall plant health improved, that this no longer happened.

I have BGA now. It's growing happily on several HOB filter outflows. While the outflow apparently provides a suitable environment, the tanks themselves do not, as it does not spread from that location. I don't know exactly why, but it's not due to nitrate levels, as they're up to 70ppm.

I'm not trying to start anything either, not a bit of malice in my reply. But really now:

"I don't think it's BGA though if indeed you kept your nitrates that high for a week or two."

The pic showed it was BGA.

"Yep, BGA all right. You have low nitrates."

His nitrates were fine.

"I don't think the test is good. BGA is better"

Admit it. You're stretching for an explanation that fits your understanding of BGA at this point. And if the OP gets another test kit and gets the same result - which I believe it will - what is the next explanation? That test kit is bad too? Something in the tank is interfering with the tests?

Been there, done that; and I believe the end result will be to leave the OP more frustrated, with the problem still unsolved, and needlessly distrustful of test kits. We may disagree, but I do not want him to end up nuking his tank. They are lovely crypts. That's all, really.
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Old 01-13-2013, 09:57 PM   #17
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I got rid of BGA by physically removing all the visible ones, then installed a fan controlled by a thermostat to make sure that the tank water could not get too warm. BGA did not return.
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Old 01-14-2013, 12:03 AM   #18
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Any antibiotics to consider? I'm looking at seachem paraguard for one...
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Old 01-14-2013, 12:13 AM   #19
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Any antibiotics to consider? I'm looking at seachem paraguard for one...
Erythromycin is the antibiotic of choice for treating cyanobacteria (BGA).
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Old 01-14-2013, 12:43 AM   #20
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I don't know all your tank parameters, but going by your OP, were you stated that you reduced light intensity (raised lights) and reduced photo period (to 8 hrs) lends itself to believe that you were running too much light for too long a period in a slow growing tank and the tank just didn't have the bio-filter to deal with it. I doubt this has anything to do with your nitrates. Why do nitrates cure BGA anyway? Since your in a reactive mode I would do the erythromycin has others have suggested.
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Old 01-14-2013, 08:13 AM   #21
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Where do you buy Erythromycin
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Old 01-14-2013, 01:59 PM   #22
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Where do you buy Erythromycin
Very places, but you can simply buy some fish meds and use it for the BGA.

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...m?pcatid=16818
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Old 01-14-2013, 05:40 PM   #23
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Epic post Dark Cobra! thank you and the community for sharing your experience and insight on the matter...

regarding the test kit accuracy and to conclude our speculation, i will purchase another nitrate kit and compare results.

i agree with houseofcards that my light was too high initially. but i have since raised the fixture >12" above the tank and reduced to a 4-2-4 (8hrs on, 2hr off rest period) photo period.

in retrospect, i doubt BGA was triggered neccessarily due to high light, as i've maintained a high light condition (albiet percieved excessive for most crypts) for well over a year before any sign of BGA. if anything BBA developed as a result and some remnants exist on my intake tube and drop checker. but this is actually under control as i reduced light and increased co2.



this is my tank (week 5) after a huge water change, major pruning of affected leaves and the cleaning filter media.

before this i've further lowered the light intensity, increased circulation and maintained >40ppm nitrates with regular pruning and w/c for several weeks already.

what pains me (and what may not be readily observed in the photo) is that the crypts are not happy.

with few exception some sp. are displaying new growth...the rest of my crop is suffering. they simply do not appreciate change.

for instance all this time i had very high light. but for many months intensity and duration have not changed, the crypts did fine. i've been EI dosing and running co2 at a constant rate and regimen, and again the crypts did well... now perhaps someone can argue they could be growing better with different parameters, but thats another discussion.

my point is my crypts (i have about 2 dozen variety in this particular tank) did Ok as long as conditions remained stable and consistent.

it seems the concept of increasing Nitrates is to ensure plants are not out competed by BGA and remain healthy thriving plants (which i guess would result in an increase in Oxygen levels that BGA despises)... unfortunately i believe i've stunted my plants.

In hind sight, i may have shocked them by doing too much (all of the above) within a short period of time (5wks). And now my crypts are showing their displeasure by a substantial melt-off.

if you keep crypts you know there will be a point the plant either bounces back or completely disintegrates... my plants have not been happy for several weeks at this point and i doubt they will recover fast enough to outlast the BGA by experimenting with methods other than the use of anti-biotics.

i think i know what i need to do.

many thanks 1
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Old 01-14-2013, 05:53 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thefisherman View Post
Epic post Dark Cobra! thank you and the community for sharing your experience and insight on the matter...

regarding the test kit accuracy and to conclude our speculation, i will purchase another nitrate kit and compare results.

i agree with houseofcards that my light was too high initially. but i have since raised the fixture >12" above the tank and reduced to a 4-2-4 (8hrs on, 2hr off rest period) photo period.

in retrospect, i doubt BGA was triggered neccessarily due to high light, as i've maintained a high light condition (albiet percieved excessive for most crypts) for well over a year before any sign of BGA. if anything BBA developed as a result and some remnants exist on my intake tube and drop checker. but this is actually under control as i reduced light and increased co2.



this is my tank (week 5) after a huge water change, major pruning of affected leaves and the cleaning filter media.

before this i've further lowered the light intensity, increased circulation and maintained >40ppm nitrates with regular pruning and w/c for several weeks already.

what pains me (and what may not be readily observed in the photo) is that the crypts are not happy.

with few exception some sp. are displaying new growth...the rest of my crop is suffering. they simply do not appreciate change.

for instance all this time i had very high light. but for many months intensity and duration have not changed, the crypts did fine. i've been EI dosing and running co2 at a constant rate and regimen, and again the crypts did well... now perhaps someone can argue they could be growing better with different parameters, but thats another discussion.

my point is my crypts (i have about 2 dozen variety in this particular tank) did Ok as long as conditions remained stable and consistent.

it seems the concept of increasing Nitrates is to ensure plants are not out competed by BGA and remain healthy thriving plants (which i guess would result in an increase in Oxygen levels that BGA despises)... unfortunately i believe i've stunted my plants.

In hind sight, i may have shocked them by doing too much (all of the above) within a short period of time (5wks). And now my crypts are showing their displeasure by a substantial melt-off.

if you keep crypts you know there will be a point the plant either bounces back or completely disintegrates... my plants have not been happy for several weeks at this point and i doubt they will recover fast enough to outlast the BGA by experimenting with methods other than the use of anti-biotics.

i think i know what i need to do.

many thanks 1
I wouldn't worried too much... crypts are extremely resilient plants. They will adjust and grow back in no time. The one thing about crypts and crypts growers is patience! Just give it time, they will bounce back. They are not stem plants so you can't see instant gratifications. Even if they melted, the rhizome with survive and come back.

Look at my tank, I experienced extreme melting because of my neglect. Now it is slowly coming back.
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Old 01-14-2013, 06:38 PM   #25
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@DarkCobra

I said from my experience what worked. There's also many articles that stipulate the high Nitrate as having an impact on BGA along with other factors that influence its spread.

Every tank is unique in its own way. The details explain better and that is a problem on most forums. Even in my case, this algae might have been destroyed by something other than Nitrates. I don't see how putting antibiotics and nuking all of the bacterial flora helps. It' like punishing everyone because of a disgruntled individual.

Bottom line, having healthy plants will cause BGA to starve as there's little to no leak of organic matter into the water column. Cleaning the tank as best as possible of any decaying organic matter also helps in starving it.

Maintaining high Nitrates along with the above should make it go away.

Hitting it from multiple angles should do the trick, making the plants/beneficial bacteria suffer because of BGA will surely not improve the situation.
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Old 01-14-2013, 06:50 PM   #26
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I may be wrong on this but here goes.

Using Erythromycin will likely not do much to the good bacteria in the tank. Most *MOST* beneficial bacteria is gram negative, Erythromycin is good at killing gram positive bacteria. So the cyano gets it cause it's gram positive while the filter doesn't really notice anything cause it's gram negative.

If you have alot of cyano and you nuke it, you just have to keep up with lots of water changes so the dead and decaying yuck doesn't mess further with your parameters.
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Old 01-14-2013, 08:07 PM   #27
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Well of course nothing works in a vacuum. Our tanks have too many variables for anyone 'really' to tell you straight out what caused BGA in 'your' tank. Point I was making about the lighting is that it might have been fine for a while, but over time as organics built up the light was too much. The one thing ALL tanks have is organic decay and how each tank deals with it. Higher light will usually result in worse algae situations if the organic decay can't be kept in check. Even when you can a tank well over time the decay builds up.
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Old 01-15-2013, 01:43 PM   #28
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Personally I got rid of cyano when I began dosing nitrates and phosphates, dosing only nitrates did nothing, or made matters worse, also adding some fast growing plants would help a lot.

It is a matter of making sure the plants get all they need, if something is lacking, plants will starve, and algae/cyano will outcompete them.

Michel.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:54 AM   #29
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got the new test kit today.

i think its safe to say my test kits are comparable and that i actually have more like 160ppm nitrates! :O

gonna start the nuke full dose tonight. fingers crossed...
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Old 01-16-2013, 03:04 AM   #30
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oops heres the right pic...
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