Problem with Mini-Ramshorn Snails

[Simpsoid]

Hi,

A few years ago I got some plants from my LFS that had Mini-Ramshorn snails on them. These are small spiral shelled snails that seem to be impervious to everything.

I previously had some regular Pond Snails from the plants at the LFS and they annoyed me but they were manageable, these Mini-Ramshorn multiply and nothing seems to kill them.

I had dosed and old tank with a product called No-Planaria that managed to kill all of the pesky Pond Snails (which I don't mind, they look nice) but it didn't do anything to the Mini-Ramshorns.

Recently I've been setting up a new aquarium. I had it perfectly hardscaped and went to seed it with some gravel from my old tank. Big mistake. Some egg-sacs or snails must have come across and now my new tank is infested. I've tried a few things but I just can't get rid of them at all.

Edit: I should add there's no food or anything being added to this tank since it's sitting empty (well it has the wood) while I build my LED lights. I'm not sure what the snails are eating but they keep growing.

Now some information about my tank. It is a Mineralised Topsoil tank that presently only has a piece of driftwood in it (no fish or plants) as I'm waiting for the driftwood to finish leeching tannins before I stock the tank. So the only thing that's living in there is an excellent bacteria colony and these pest Mini-Ramshorn snails (they are just like Ramshorn snails in shape but they grow to about 2 - 3mm across ad are hideously ugly).

I have tried squashing them. I've used the No-Planaria again but it doesn't seem to affect Mini-Ramshorns at all. I have (over)dosed on Cupramine for a few days. It knocked them down but they came back after about 5 days (I guess more eggs hatched). I have dosed with Copper Sulphate and this hasn't affected them (the dosage was quite small and testing with my new copper kit it didn't even seem to break 0.25ppm in my 200 Litre tank). I've previously dipped plants in Potassium Permanganate (and so I have that) but I don't want to dose it into my tank presently in case it kills my bacteria colony.

I have nothing in my tank and every 2 weeks I am draining it fully to get rid of the tannin infused water so I don't mind dosing strongly with copper based products.

Is there something I can try? I can't get access to Assassin Snails (illegal in Australia) and I don't really want to stock any Loaches or anything into my tank yet (because I don't want them in there in the end when I set up my fish community). I'm happy to try traps or poisons but I really don't want my bacteria colony to suffer and I also want to kill them all. What can I do to wipe them out completely for good in my tank (nuclear options welcomed)?

[ch3fb0yrdee]

Is the current tank going to be a shrimp only tank? The reason I ask is because I have the same type of snails infecting a couple of my tanks and I notice that the tanks with the snails actually do BETTER than the tanks without. I think it has something to do with the snails eating the excess waste and the babies (shrimplets) feeding off the microorganism in the snail's poop.

Also, these mini-ram horns snails lay flat against the glass wall of the tanks as they climb so it makes for really easy for spot target killing. I would just squish the snails when the population gets wildly out of control. They're a good source for fresh protein if the tank is a shrimp tank.

[Simpsoid]

I'll have shrimp in my tank. Probably just Cherry Red's (since I've never kept shrimp before). It'll mostly be an Australian Community tank with some Cardinal Tetras, Otos and Rainbowfish schools of various type (Praecox etc.).

I assume the shrimps would have plenty to feed on with plants and other fish waste in there so I don't really want the snails.

As I said I already overdosed my tank with Seachems Cupramine. It killed all of the live snails I could see but a few days later there were babies (and some bigger ones, obviously ones that stayed alive during the poisoning).

I just don't like the mini-ramshorn. they are very ugly and look really weedy (and yes they are the one's that lie flat against the glass). I do like the pond snails so I'd rather have them in my tanks than mini ramshorns.

I have been squishing them when I see them but I've since read that if you squish a pregnant snail (female I assume?) that they could possibly release their eggs into the tank and they'll then grow. It sounds correct but I'm not sure whether this in fact happens.

[azjenny]

I'm confused, why did you even seed it if you weren't putting anything in? If nothing is being added to the tank aren't you going to lose your cycle?

[skystrife]

Originally Posted by azjenny

I'm confused, why did you even seed it if you weren't putting anything in? If nothing is being added to the tank aren't you going to lose your cycle?

I'd bet he's adding an artificial ammonia source (like household cleaning ammonia) to keep the bacteria colony around.

[auban]

pour carbonated water (seltzer water/club soda) into the tank. it wont kill the bacteria below the top of the substrate, but will kill anything that requires lots of oxygen(snails). it drops the PH so fast that the snails instantly start suffocating while their shells start dissolving. just turn off the filter and any source of flow, or they might be able to survive by hiding around the substrate. you will likely see them try to leave the water. if they do, just collect them up and dispose of them as you see fit.

when you want to add something to the tank later, you wont have to worry about any chemicals remaining that could harm your livestock.

[genetao]

Originally Posted by auban

pour carbonated water (seltzer water/club soda) into the tank. it wont kill the bacteria below the top of the substrate, but will kill anything that requires lots of oxygen(snails). it drops the PH so fast that the snails instantly start suffocating while their shells start dissolving. just turn off the filter and any source of flow, or they might be able to survive by hiding around the substrate. you will likely see them try to leave the water. if they do, just collect them up and dispose of them as you see fit.

when you want to add something to the tank later, you wont have to worry about any chemicals remaining that could harm your livestock.

Man, that's genius!!! I gotta try that!

[pinoyghost2]

Just keep them until they are a half decent size then sell them off to other members. I raise ramshorns in all my shrimp tanks (sell them at auctions) the shrimps don't care, and the snails eat any leftovers, so its a good trade.

Pond snails I would pick off and keep in one tank (no filter just some plants for them to snack on) and when they grew a bit I would squish them and feed them to my CPOs....great for growing those babies fast as the meat from the snails is high protein.

Always a way to make something off these snails...no need to kill then just re-organize your thinking and find a use for them.

[Betta Maniac]

He's not talking about regular ramshorns. The mini ones (which I also got an infestation of from plants from a major online seller) don't ever get bigger than a few mm. They're just a fricken mess. Assassin snails were the only thing that worked for me. Haven’t seen a mini in almost a year (plenty of regular ramshorns and pond snails though!).

[genetao]

Originally Posted by Betta Maniac

He's not talking about regular ramshorns. The mini ones (which I also got an infestation of from plants from a major online seller) don't ever get bigger than a few mm. They're just a fricken mess. Assassin snails were the only thing that worked for me. Haven’t seen a mini in almost a year (plenty of regular ramshorns and pond snails though!).

Betta Maniac is right. These little mini ramshorn snails are pretty freakin' tiny. Like 1 mm in diameter. Hard to pick out of the tank because they're so stinkin' tiny. A total nuisance much more so than regular sized ramhorn snails, because at such a tiny size, these guys are already breeding.

Wait, so you're telling me that an assassin snail that's like 20 times bigger can still get into the shell of a tiny ramhorn snail? I originally thought of going the assassin snail route, but scrapped that idea because I thought there's no way an assassin snail is gonna be able to get into an tiny ramshorn snail's shell.

[Betta Maniac]

I can't promise you that they're what did it, but they did disapper within a few months of my adding the assassins (who have now moved on to pond and regular ramshorns, of which my tanks also has plenty, LOL!). So glad too. They were like tank acane.

[Simpsoid]

Originally Posted by azjenny

I'm confused, why did you even seed it if you weren't putting anything in? If nothing is being added to the tank aren't you going to lose your cycle?

It was my mistake. I was going to try to get the tank set up quickly but I got sidetracked with programming my light controller. It's just been empty for about 6 weeks so I shouldn't have even bothered with the seeding and just let it cycle itself. Oh well.

Originally Posted by skystrife

I'd bet he's adding an artificial ammonia source (like household cleaning ammonia) to keep the bacteria colony around.

I did try with rotting shrimp and also some fish food. It turns out the fish food might have had nematode eggs in it because I got an outbreak of little white worms but they've gone now. I also added in some urine . It worked well, the next day I had a bacteria explosion that clouded my tank. But the water smelt and I've emptied it a few times since then. I'm not presently adding in any ammonia source (clear / pure ammonia is restricted in Australia so don't have access to that either, I'm just relying on the dying snails to supply this now).

Originally Posted by auban

pour carbonated water (seltzer water/club soda) into the tank.

Thanks for this info. I might try this. I want to lower the pH a bit (it sits at about 8.2 now) and was waiting until I got my pressurised CO2 but I think a seltzer tablet will be very easy. Does it just carbonate the tank? It doesn't release anything else into the tank does it?

[Koro-chan]

Try this..

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...highlight=otos

[CookieM]

Best method I've ever use to get rid of pond snail and ramshorn is introducing Assassin Snails. Depending on the size of your tank and infestation. I use 5 assassins in a 10 gallon with approximately 100 ramshorm.