Opening Dose of Excel not looking too good

Seattle_Aquarist · 12-05-2012, 01:53 AM

Hi ANTIplastic,

If it has been over 24 hours the Excel has worn off.

It looks like you have a lot of dissolved organics (tannins) in that tank. How long has that wood been in your tank?

ANTIplastic · 12-05-2012, 11:41 AM

the main big "stump" like piece of DW has been in there for over 3 months. The other vine like pieces are fairly new. I'd say about 3 weeks. I never notice any serious cloudiness such as this. How would DW spark a white cloud 3 weeks later?

ANTIplastic · 12-05-2012, 11:46 AM

As I've been dealing with this it's crossed my mind that in some ways its as if I started a new cycle on my tank. I say this because I switched out my light bulbs. I had a simple T8 full spectrum then I changed it to a T8 Floramax bulb to help my plants. Then I switched out both of my filter sponges as I do once a month, then of course I added a dose of Excel. This was all done in one day and ever since then I have had this white cloud.

biggerbang · 12-05-2012, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ANTIplastic

As I've been dealing with this it's crossed my mind that in some ways its as if I started a new cycle on my tank. I say this because I switched out my light bulbs. I had a simple T8 full spectrum then I changed it to a T8 Floramax bulb to help my plants. Then I switched out both of my filter sponges as I do once a month, then of course I added a dose of Excel. This was all done in one day and ever since then I have had this white cloud.

You replaced all of the filter sponges in your filter? The beneficial bacteria takes home in those filters, so if you remove them, it would cause another cycle I believe. When I had a white cloudiness to my tank, it was the bacterial bloom establishing the cycle. If your filter has two sponges, I would replace one only and leave the other one. But even at that point, it would only be necessary if the filter sponge is extremely clogged with detritus that replacing it would be required. Most of the time, just a squeeze and a rinse in tank water or water that has been dechlorinated would suffice.

Seattle_Aquarist · 12-05-2012, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ANTIplastic

As I've been dealing with this it's crossed my mind that in some ways its as if I started a new cycle on my tank. I say this because I switched out my light bulbs. I had a simple T8 full spectrum then I changed it to a T8 Floramax bulb to help my plants. Then I switched out both of my filter sponges as I do once a month, then of course I added a dose of Excel. This was all done in one day and ever since then I have had this white cloud.

Hi ANTIplastic,

Congrats! I think you have answered your own question. I try to remember that my aquarium operates as a 'system' and changing just one thing can have an affect on several others. I can't tell you how many times what I thought was the 'obvious' cause of a problem was not the cause at all.

Your tank will need to cycle again. Test for ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates and do water changes as necessary to keep levels down. If you have another tank take some mulm from the filter and add it to the filter of this tank to help 'jump start' the process.

**TexasCichlid** · 12-05-2012, 02:45 PM

You have no plants? ( basically none ) Why add Excel?

**kevmo911** · 12-05-2012, 11:35 PM

When you say "switched out", do you mean you cleaned them, or literally swapped the old sponges for new ones?

I have several HOB's mostly AC's, and a canister, and I probably keep the same sponges for a year. Filter floss tends to break apart sooner, so I replace that stuff maybe every 6 months. Once a month, a few squeezes, sit for a few minutes, and a couple swooshes, all in tank water, and I'm good to go (except for the one prefilter I use on an AC70 - that gets squeezed in running tapwater as many times as it takes to get clear water ...and those only last a few months due to this abuse).

ANTIplastic · 12-06-2012, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TexasCichlid

You have no plants? ( basically none ) Why add Excel?

I have 3 bunches of jungle val, 3 amazon swords, 2 bunches of anacharis, 4 banana plants, and 2 bunches of wisteria. They are all in the back-I swear. It's not a jungle, but I'm working on it. I took that picture to capture the cloud more than anything.

ANTIplastic · 12-06-2012, 01:22 AM

Sorry if I state the obvious to anyone, but the aquaclear 30 comes with a three part system. From bottom to top it goes Foam, the carbon bag, and the Bio Max bag. I understood it to be that you rotate out every month the foam filter (which are the ones I replaced) and the other two you keep going. I guess I was way off?

**kevmo911** · 12-06-2012, 01:48 AM

If the carbon bag has been in there more than a month or two, it's no longer chemical filtration (which is generally totally unnecessary except in very specific, short-term circumstances, IMO). Instead, it's simply biological filtration, and does the same job as the BioMax.

I'm a fan of strictly mech filtration, and therefore don't use bio-balls, rings, or any other high-surface-area bio media at all in any of my HOB's or can (mech media dual-purposes as bio media). Many disagree, and use a combo of mech and bio. Fairly few, however, run chem media 24/7.

You can set your filter up however you like, and it will probably do its job just fine. However, replacing the mech media monthly is a waste of both beneficial bacteria and perfectly functional mech media.

If your problem stems from a mini-cycle, this may be the root of, and solution to, your problem.

danakin · 12-06-2012, 04:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ANTIplastic

I have 3 bunches of jungle val, 3 amazon swords, 2 bunches of anacharis, 4 banana plants, and 2 bunches of wisteria..

Be careful. Excel will absolutely melt vals and anachris. You'd be better served with DIY CO2 for this plant load. They're all relatively low maintenance anyway.

ANTIplastic · 12-06-2012, 04:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danakin

Be careful. Excel will absolutely melt vals and anachris. You'd be better served with DIY CO2 for this plant load. They're all relatively low maintenance anyway.

Really? I've never heard this before.

danakin · 12-06-2012, 04:38 AM

Largely a "your mileage may vary" deal, but give this thread a read: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=25341

ANTIplastic · 12-06-2012, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danakin

Largely a "your mileage may vary" deal, but give this thread a read: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=25341

Just read it. Thanks. Strange enough, my Anacharis looks fine. My Wisteria, Banana plants, and Vals look like they went through a mower. The Amazon swords look okay. I'm still at one loss in regards to fish.

ANTIplastic · 12-06-2012, 02:11 PM

This has mos def been a learning experience for me. Thanks for everyones help and restraining as best you could in saying "YOU ARE A DUMMIE".

I feel like I've hit a bit of a reset button on my tank and that's fine as long as I can progress from the mistakes.

As of right now I've taken out all of the driftwood I collected myself. I'm just going to buy some spiderwood I saw at a local pet shop and stay with that for awhile. I just received a C02 diffuser in the mail so I'm going to work on a DIY system and just back off the Excel and maybe just dose some Flourish twice a week.

Thanks again for everyones help/advice.

12-05-2012, 01:53 AM	#16
Seattle_Aquarist Planted Tank Guru (View User Tanks) PTrader: (25/100%) Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 2,027	Hi ANTIplastic, If it has been over 24 hours the Excel has worn off. It looks like you have a lot of dissolved organics (tannins) in that tank. How long has that wood been in your tank? __________________ *Roy* 45 Gallon Tall; 96 Watt AH Supply CF; 6700K; & 30 Gallon Long; 2X36 Watt AH Supply CF; Press. CO2; UGF; Heat Treated Montmorillonite Clay Greater Seattle Aquarium Society (GSAS)

12-05-2012, 02:45 PM	#21
TexasCichlid Wannabe Guru (View User Tanks) PTrader: (18/100%) Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Texas Posts: 1,272	You have no plants? ( basically none ) Why add Excel? __________________ ADA 60P Iwagumi JBJ 3G Picotope - PFR Factory

12-06-2012, 04:38 AM	#28
danakin Planted Tank Enthusiast (View User Tanks) PTrader: (1/100%) Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Midland, MI Posts: 504	Largely a "your mileage may vary" deal, but give this thread a read: http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=25341 __________________ My 40g Breeder Stress Reliever

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12-05-2012, 11:41 AM	#17
ANTIplastic Algae Grower (View User Tanks) PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: United States Posts: 62	the main big "stump" like piece of DW has been in there for over 3 months. The other vine like pieces are fairly new. I'd say about 3 weeks. I never notice any serious cloudiness such as this. How would DW spark a white cloud 3 weeks later?

12-05-2012, 11:46 AM	#18
ANTIplastic Algae Grower (View User Tanks) PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: United States Posts: 62	As I've been dealing with this it's crossed my mind that in some ways its as if I started a new cycle on my tank. I say this because I switched out my light bulbs. I had a simple T8 full spectrum then I changed it to a T8 Floramax bulb to help my plants. Then I switched out both of my filter sponges as I do once a month, then of course I added a dose of Excel. This was all done in one day and ever since then I have had this white cloud.

12-05-2012, 11:35 PM	#22
kevmo911 Planted Tank Guru (View User Tanks) PTrader: (32/100%) Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 3,750	When you say "switched out", do you mean you cleaned them, or literally swapped the old sponges for new ones? I have several HOB's mostly AC's, and a canister, and I probably keep the same sponges for a year. Filter floss tends to break apart sooner, so I replace that stuff maybe every 6 months. Once a month, a few squeezes, sit for a few minutes, and a couple swooshes, all in tank water, and I'm good to go (except for the one prefilter I use on an AC70 - that gets squeezed in running tapwater as many times as it takes to get clear water ...and those only last a few months due to this abuse).

12-06-2012, 01:22 AM	#24
ANTIplastic Algae Grower (View User Tanks) PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: United States Posts: 62	Sorry if I state the obvious to anyone, but the aquaclear 30 comes with a three part system. From bottom to top it goes Foam, the carbon bag, and the Bio Max bag. I understood it to be that you rotate out every month the foam filter (which are the ones I replaced) and the other two you keep going. I guess I was way off?

12-06-2012, 01:48 AM	#25
kevmo911 Planted Tank Guru (View User Tanks) PTrader: (32/100%) Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 3,750	If the carbon bag has been in there more than a month or two, it's no longer chemical filtration (which is generally totally unnecessary except in very specific, short-term circumstances, IMO). Instead, it's simply biological filtration, and does the same job as the BioMax. I'm a fan of strictly mech filtration, and therefore don't use bio-balls, rings, or any other high-surface-area bio media at all in any of my HOB's or can (mech media dual-purposes as bio media). Many disagree, and use a combo of mech and bio. Fairly few, however, run chem media 24/7. You can set your filter up however you like, and it will probably do its job just fine. However, replacing the mech media monthly is a waste of both beneficial bacteria and perfectly functional mech media. If your problem stems from a mini-cycle, this may be the root of, and solution to, your problem.

12-06-2012, 02:11 PM	#30
ANTIplastic Algae Grower (View User Tanks) PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: United States Posts: 62	This has mos def been a learning experience for me. Thanks for everyones help and restraining as best you could in saying "YOU ARE A DUMMIE". I feel like I've hit a bit of a reset button on my tank and that's fine as long as I can progress from the mistakes. As of right now I've taken out all of the driftwood I collected myself. I'm just going to buy some spiderwood I saw at a local pet shop and stay with that for awhile. I just received a C02 diffuser in the mail so I'm going to work on a DIY system and just back off the Excel and maybe just dose some Flourish twice a week. Thanks again for everyones help/advice.