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Old 11-19-2012, 04:46 PM   #16
idleivey
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Thanks! Just using a 13watt 6500k CFL. It's been working fine although I wish I had a taller lamp so I could move the bulb further away from the bowl.

Last edited by idleivey; 11-19-2012 at 06:16 PM.. Reason: spelling
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:15 PM   #17
Coldnorthtoy
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Thanks! Just using a 13watt 6500k CFL. It's been working fine although I wish I had a taller lamp so I could move the bulb further away from the bowl.
You could try something like this; I have this sitting on the mesh top of my 5.5 gallon Glass Shrimp tank, and it works nicely. You could possibly clamp it to the cubicle top and it should sit perfectly over the bowl.

...And I have that bowl at home. With nothing in it. I think it's coming to work with me tomorrow.
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Old 12-02-2012, 01:58 PM   #18
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This is sweet! Do you add any ferts, or just a weekly water change? How much water do you change out with the water change?
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Old 12-02-2012, 05:56 PM   #19
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This is sweet! Do you add any ferts, or just a weekly water change? How much water do you change out with the water change?
Thanks! No ferts or any additives. I pretty much top off weekly and have been doing bi-weekly water water changes of 50% or so. The tank has also been cycled fully for a month or so. Before then I was doing weekly 50% changes.
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Old 12-02-2012, 08:05 PM   #20
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Please rehome that paradise fish. I have a trio myself and they are very active fast swimming little things that really deserve an absolute minimum of 2ft of swimming space. They have an intelligence and insatiable curiosity similar to the larger preds (and a ferocity to match) so he is likely bored out of his mind too. To those saying get a heater, its probably not worth it unless the tank is close to freezing. These fish are very hardy and do very well at room temp or even in ponds if you live somewhere it wont freeze over. I know how easy it is to make these sort of mistakes but a little research would show you how colourful a healthy paradise fish is. Here are my ladies and they are no where near as colourful or as large as a male:




I started out with them in a 29g but they needed more space and are now happily enjoying a 75g with the male and some fast swimming shoalers but as you can see they still spar over territory.

Last edited by ony; 12-02-2012 at 08:27 PM.. Reason: typo
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Old 12-02-2012, 08:35 PM   #21
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Please rehome that paradise fish. I have a trio myself and they are very active fast swimming little things that really deserve an absolute minimum of 2ft of swimming space. They have an intelligence and insatiable curiosity similar to the larger preds (and a ferocity to match) so he is likely bored out of his mind too. To those saying get a heater, its probably not worth it unless the tank is close to freezing. These fish are very hardy and do very well at room temp or even in ponds if you live somewhere it wont freeze over. I know how easy it is to make these sort of mistakes but a little research would show you how colourful a healthy paradise fish is. Here are my ladies and they are no where near as colourful or as large as a male:

I started out with them in a 29g but they needed more space and are now happily enjoying a 75g with the male and some fast swimming shoalers but as you can see they still spar over territory.
My fish is quite happy in his environment. I don't know where you get 2ft of swimming space as their natural habits don't typical support that. As far as being bored I guarantee my fish gets more attention then yours do. I sit a play with him throughout the day, 8 hours a day 5 days a week. When I'm not around for those 2 days my cube mates often come over to say Hi.

He gets fed live food weekly and I stock the tank with small pond snails that he spends much of the day hunting for and eating. He is constantly active and entertained.
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Old 12-02-2012, 08:59 PM   #22
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My fish is quite happy in his environment. I don't know where you get 2ft of swimming space as their natural habits don't typical support that. As far as being bored I guarantee my fish gets more attention then yours do. I sit a play with him throughout the day, 8 hours a day 5 days a week. When I'm not around for those 2 days my cube mates often come over to say Hi.

He gets fed live food weekly and I stock the tank with small pond snails that he spends much of the day hunting for and eating. He is constantly active and entertained.
My recommendation comes from owning and watching my own fish. They use every inch of my 75g but I think a single (probably stunted) specimen would do ok in a 2ft aquarium if it was as beautifully planted as your bowl.

http://www.seriouslyfish.com/species...s-opercularis/

Possibly the most respected source of caresheets about atm and that suggests a minimum of 30 inches. Hes a fish, he doesn't need human companionship but he does need space to hunt, swim, nest and do everything else that comes naturally. From your photos he looks very pale, as the only occupant of the tank he should have strong dark colours to proclaim his health and dominance. He looks like one of my ladies when they have just lost a fight and are signalling their submission. Its a very clear sign of stress and has alerted me to problems in the past.
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Old 12-02-2012, 09:15 PM   #23
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My recommendation comes from owning and watching my own fish. They use every inch of my 75g but I think a single (probably stunted) specimen would do ok in a 2ft aquarium if it was as beautifully planted as your bowl.

http://www.seriouslyfish.com/species...s-opercularis/

Possibly the most respected source of caresheets about atm and that suggests a minimum of 30 inches. Hes a fish, he doesn't need human companionship but he does need space to hunt, swim, nest and do everything else that comes naturally. From your photos he looks very pale, as the only occupant of the tank he should have strong dark colours to proclaim his health and dominance. He looks like one of my ladies when they have just lost a fight and are signalling their submission. Its a very clear sign of stress and has alerted me to problems in the past.
The recommendation you site is for a pair of fish, a fish that is notoriously territorial. I don't see how that applies to my case. I also don't what "clear sign of stress" you see but his color and activity are fine so your going to be more clear.

As far as sources for tank size I find this white paper written by University of Michigan professors to be much more applicable. The paper is a study of early and adult social behavior in paradise fish. If you read you will see that they use tanks ranging from .5 gallons, 2.3 gallons, 5 gallons and 10 gallons to conduct their experiments.
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Old 12-02-2012, 09:44 PM   #24
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The recommendation you site is for a pair of fish, a fish that is notoriously territorial. I don't see how that applies to my case. I also don't what "clear sign of stress" you see but his color a activity are fine so your going to be more clear.

My comments that he looks stressed were based on his colour, he looks very pale in your photos and that is a sure sign of stress in this species. If thats just a trick of the light then I apologize but even with a flash Ive never seen my chap look so ghostly. This is another trustworthy care sheet that has a recommendation for a single specimen.

http://badmanstropicalfish.com/profiles/profile55.html

This is the first one on google, it happens to be from a very good forum that provides advice for new fishkeepers.

http://www.fishkeeping.co.uk/modules...aresheetID=203

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Originally Posted by idleivey View Post
As far as sources for tank size I find this white paper written by University of Michigan professors to be much more applicable. The paper is a study of early and adult social behavior in paradise fish. If you read you will see that they use tanks ranging from .5 gallons, 2.3 gallons, 5 gallons and 10 gallons to conduct their experiments.
I'm not sure animal testing labs have the best track record when it comes to animal welfare. Its also not a justification of bad practice to say that someone else does worse, that would just be a race to the bottom. I'm not trying to make you feel bad, you obviously care about your fish but he really would benefit from some extra space.
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Old 12-02-2012, 10:02 PM   #25
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This could go back an forth all day but I will say that your dismissal of my last source seems flippant. They are studying the behavior of the fish, putting them in an environment that would unduly stress them would defeat the purpose of the experiment.

By saying that "I'm not sure animal testing labs have the best track record when it comes to animal welfare" your completely avoiding the point with an inflammatory statement. I did not site an animal testing lab at all, rather a scientific study done by a major educational institution.

Finally the assumption that that these are "bad practices" simply because they deviate from your own shows a clear bias.
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Old 12-02-2012, 11:23 PM   #26
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This could go back an forth all day but I will say that your dismissal of my last source seems flippant. They are studying the behavior of the fish, putting them in an environment that would unduly stress them would defeat the purpose of the experiment. By saying that "I'm not sure animal testing labs have the best track record when it comes to animal welfare" your completely avoiding the point with an inflammatory statement. I did not site an animal testing lab at all, rather a scientific study done by a major educational institution.
An animal testing lab that is part of the University of Michigan is still an animal testing lab. I believe animal testing is a necessary evil but its not an excuse to treat pets the same way : /

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Finally the assumption that that these are "bad practices" simply because they deviate from your own shows a clear bias.
I believe that keeping an animal in conditions that don't allow it to exhibit natural behavioral patterns is bad practice. Since you appear to enjoy a scientific approach maybe the only way to find out for certain is to move your fish to a larger tank and do plenty of personal observation. There is no substitute for personal observation and experimentation IMO and I promise once you see the difference you would never even think about returning him to a bowl.
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Old 12-05-2012, 12:49 PM   #27
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I believe that keeping an animal in conditions that don't allow it to exhibit natural behavioral patterns is bad practice.
Source: Pseudosphromenus cupanus inhabits lowland streams, freshwater ponds and even ditches. It is a hardy species and is a very excitable bubblenester and jumps more often than other bubblenest building fishes (Chhapgar and Manakadan 2000).

So my bowl is a ditch in this example. It's still a natural condition in which the animal lives, as you said. To say that the fish would be "happier" in a larger environment is projecting human emotions on the fish of which it does not posses. If the fish is health and active it's "happy".
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Old 12-05-2012, 02:45 PM   #28
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Source: Pseudosphromenus cupanus inhabits lowland streams, freshwater ponds and even ditches. It is a hardy species and is a very excitable bubblenester and jumps more often than other bubblenest building fishes (Chhapgar and Manakadan 2000).

So my bowl is a ditch in this example. It's still a natural condition in which the animal lives, as you said. To say that the fish would be "happier" in a larger environment is projecting human emotions on the fish of which it does not posses. If the fish is health and active it's "happy".
1) How many 4 gallon ditches have you seen? Thats barely a pothole, let alone a pond or a river. A body of water that small is likely to dry up before the next rainy season.

2) Paradise fish are incredible survivors but just because yours is alive and still moving it doesn't mean that it is healthy. I understand that you want to think your pet is happy as you obviously care about him but you aren't doing him any favours.

3) The species we own is Macropodus opercularis.
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Old 12-05-2012, 02:49 PM   #29
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If it grows to be more than 2", I'd say its too cramped in a heavily planted tank that won't have all 5G of volume as available swimming space.

If it grows to be more than 3-4" then a 20G at the smallest.

There are more exceptions at the 1-2" level but next to none at the 4" level.

That's usually the role of thumb before its reviewed on a case-by-case basis. However, I would say that the 3-4" rule is pretty universal regardless of the fish you have.
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Old 12-05-2012, 02:57 PM   #30
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Also, when making the size argument please be aware that you have far less than 5G of available volume for the fish. It's probably closer to 2.5. It's tough to say how big a ditch or stream in its natural environment is, but I think we can all agree that its likely to be more than 2-3G.

Again, this is your choice. But let's be real here lol.
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