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Old 08-31-2012, 03:17 AM   #31
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Oh ya, with high stocking, well run hydro piece, there are examples of around 3:1 grow bed:tank volume, but like anything else in life higher performance means higher maintenance, holding design and build quality constant.
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Old 08-31-2012, 03:23 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by xenxes View Post
Is a bubbler/aerator sufficient, or should I go with ebb and flow via a bell siphon? Aerogardens pods are just constantly in water with an aerator in the bottom, tomatoes, lettuce, a variety of other things grow just fine.
Google deep water culture.
Bubblers work, and work better on a timer. Recirculating dwc is what the system I posted used, it is good for small tanks without a sump because the fish don't get the huge swing in tank water height so less stress. Dwc grown plants don't seem to transplant as well as ebb and flow for me. I also find air pumps to be noisy, and air stones clog over long time periods and are harder to clean than pipes.

That said, for anything serious, I would definitely do a sump and ebb and flow.
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Old 08-31-2012, 03:27 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by DogFish View Post
That tank would be good from a sanitation aspect. It's way to over-crowded from a health stand point, rule of thumb is 20gl 1st fancy gold fish the
+10gl for additional. So maybe 3 baseball sized fancys in a 40-55 gl tank.

I don't care for the "Train Station" look of too many fish in a tanks (especially bigger fish) pacing back & forth.

I like your thoughts on a few simple plants. I thought about a weather loach but they really like to burring themselves in fine sand And I don't want to have any substrate in mine. All planting will be in clay pots. Weather loaches really should be in man pairs or trios tone happy. The also get to 9-10". I do like that they are cool water fish like fancy goldfish.

I would advise to take one's time and find the nicest specimens. You can find info on several fancy gold fish sites. Since they can live well over 10 years it worth the effort to pick a young fish that will have resale/rehome value. Look for thing like uniform fins, correct lenght to body, body shape, clean colors and markings etc.

Here's a good page on what a proper Oranda should look like:
http://www.bristol-aquarists.org.uk/...nda/oranda.htm

I've occasionally seen very nice Orandas in PetSmart. It's rare but they do show up. They bodes are usual fine it's the fins that you need to examine.

I was thing the same as you on my cycles 15 on - 45 off during the Photo Period.
Stocking is more of an aesthetics/behavioral question for aquaponics. It's not like a fish tank. You have huge amounts of biomedia, and if your nitrates start to climb consistently, add more grow beds.
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Old 08-31-2012, 03:35 AM   #34
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SO im curious as to what is dosed to the water besides feed for the fish? any sort of macro/ micro fertilization going on here?
Some use Worm casting tea, filter through peat and activated carbon. Worm castings supposedly have a good micro complex, but info I've read varies. It probably depends what you feed the worms.

I occasionally add some sea weed extract for potassium, and for micros you can cut your top off water with a little tap. I've been using pferts brand micros and buffering Ro with a potassium bicarbonate calcium bicarbonate mix. My produce may no longer be "organic" but I'm not trying to sell it and I had the stuff laying around.

The goal is to add as little as possible besides food. The hydroton actually has a ton of iron in it already and gets better with time (like huge puffy chunks of flourite). There are reports of systems crashing due to nutrient lock out caused by over dosing. This is analagous to a super low tech tank.
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Old 08-31-2012, 03:42 AM   #35
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That is one of my Lotto-Fantisys, an Aquaponic Geo-dome green house/fish room
Has anyone ran the globe? Greenhouse would be awesome, but that globe pic seems misleading. I'm pretty sure salmon need a salty part of their lifecycle and get huge/need cold water and carnivorous food, same with trout.

Carrots and other root crops don't do good. In hydroton or gravel you end up with something that expanded into the free space, so would not be recognizable as the well formed roots were used to. Maybe in coco fiber or a less dense substrate.
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Old 08-31-2012, 03:48 AM   #36
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I had an ebb and flow on the top of my goldfish tank, growing lettuce for my rabbits. Then my pump died a horrible, silent death and I went back to deep water culture, which still works well for mint and lettuce.

I could never get enough plant growth to do more than mildly supplement water changes, though. It has been very frustrating. I have given up on soliciting advice.

I keep thinking that if I could plumb in a bigger hydroponics area, I would get somewhere. But I would also need lots of grow lights, and a huge pump with a prefilter that would need to be cleaned daily, and I just don't have the space or the money.
Forgot to mention that I have dreamed of an aquaponics system where the excess produce was used to grow a secondary meat source, though worm bin may be better for the system.
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Old 08-31-2012, 07:32 AM   #37
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What size is the tank in your rack design? What is the clearance like between shelves? I did a stacked garden once, but I got sick of having the tank on the floor for viewing purposes.

For lighting check out the hydrofarm t5ho strip lights. Daisy chainable with decent reflectors. Lettuce etc don't need much light.

How large are the tilapia?
The tank is about 140 gallons. Clearance in between the two plant media containers is a bit too little, it's only just over 10 in.
Kind of an architectural sacrifice there...

I'll look into those lights, thanks.

the male Tilapias are close to a foot now.
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Old 08-31-2012, 01:51 PM   #38
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Stocking is more of an aesthetics/behavioral question for aquaponics. It's not like a fish tank. You have huge amounts of biomedia, and if your nitrates start to climb consistently, add more grow beds.

I agree 100% hence my comment about the "Train Station" look of the Fancy Goldfish in the video link. If you go that route would will find they are very good little POOP factories.

You'll also find that larger excellent specimens will have some resale value.

In my home I just don't see the having space to raise table fish in a cost effective manner.

My Level II goal is a pond outdoors next year with grow beds. Fish will be cichlids. As I've raised them outdoors in the past.
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Old 08-31-2012, 02:02 PM   #39
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Forgot to mention that I have dreamed of an aquaponics system where the excess produce was used to grow a secondary meat source, though worm bin may be better for the system.
Brilliant!!!

Feed the veggie scraps to a worm bed, feed the worms to the fish!!!

Hmmm.....the first thing that pops in my head is keeping an Oscar. You could process the worms & and some veggie scrap to make Goldfish food also.


This is becoming a great brainstorming the thread

Last edited by DogFish; 08-31-2012 at 02:52 PM.. Reason: Sp.
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Old 08-31-2012, 02:35 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by Gooberfish View Post
If you dose ANYTHING, you can no longer call your plants "organic." The fish waste fertilize the plants.
That of course would depend on what exactly he was dosing.
Fish waste will fertilize the plants but depending on fish to plant ratio may not be enough.
There's a hydroponics farm near here that claims to be organic. So it can be done organically with added fertz.
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Old 09-01-2012, 01:32 AM   #41
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Hmm. I did not know that about hydroton; it is what I use. I do fertilize with potassium daily, with iron added 1-2 times a week.

So I guess I need a way to set up bigger, deeper grow beds.

I already failed plumbing once. (Could be two or three times, depending on how you count the various failures.) I have thought about purchasing hydroponic components and attaching them to my tank instead of a reservoir. This way, I do not drill holes that might leak.
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Old 09-01-2012, 02:46 AM   #42
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Subscribed! I have just started looking into this very topic. My husband and I have been thinking about starting a small indoor system with goldfish and kitchen herbs and then, once we get the hang of things moving on to a larger outdoor system with veggies and tilapia.

We have only just started researching but it looks very cool.
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Old 09-02-2012, 06:50 AM   #43
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The tank is about 140 gallons. Clearance in between the two plant media containers is a bit too little, it's only just over 10 in.
Kind of an architectural sacrifice there...

I'll look into those lights, thanks.

the male Tilapias are close to a foot now.
What are the dimensions of the tank and how many fish?

Any spawns?

Ya, 10" is rough. It looks great though! I find that you want to give yourself about 18" between the top of the substrate and the light, otherwise you will be constantly trimming. More for crops taller than lettuce and less shade tolerance, but then you are getting into multibulb fixtures and pushing the limits of flourescents. It sucks, but the best info on indoor gardening with lights comes from the pot growers forum. For taller plants, like tomatoes, you could do vertical flourescents and a cfl at the top, or go hid. Flouros are best watt per watt but lack the penetrating power of hid, and so are not always good for tall light loving plants unless you don't mind a less productive understory.

If you want to flower in the off season you will almost certainly need an enclosed cabinet, which is probably the most efficient for indoor grows regardless of your goals.

If I remember, tomorrow I will post some links that show good vertical systems that get around the height limitations, but you still can't expect to gain much in terms of output per footprint without going very tall. The trick with hydro is that it does let you place things closer together due to less extensive root system, but the leaves still need light. Think of leaf lettuce kind of like crypts, plant them with some space and the leaves fall open in even layers, but plant them close and the leaves stand up, butting against eachother and forming a tight rosette.
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Old 09-02-2012, 05:45 PM   #44
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I'm gonna shoot myself. Just tried to hang a breeder net of hydroton off the side of the tank - it's too heavy and won't stay in place! Oh, well; maybe I can trade the net for some more plants.

For now, I draped some of the mint over the side of the tank, with the roots in the water; I've heard that will work, too.
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Old 09-02-2012, 06:52 PM   #45
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What are the dimensions of the tank and how many fish?
The tank I've got the Tilapias in is 150 cm (5') x 70 cm (2'4") x 65 cm (2'2").
Some 680 liters / 170 gallons.

There's only 8 fish in it so far.

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Originally Posted by pandacory View Post
Any spawns?
They spawn constantly, but as long as I have no use for extra fish, I leave it all in there and gets eaten.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pandacory View Post
Ya, 10" is rough. It looks great though! I find that you want to give yourself about 18" between the top of the substrate and the light, otherwise you will be constantly trimming.
Yeah, the rack does look great, doesn't it? It was designed to be a demo more than an actual producing system.
Turned out pretty expensive, the white parts are Corian™.

The system in my kitchen is a bit more rough and I'm really just trying to figure out how to go with it.

Been trying to figure out some vertical systems, so please do post whatever inspiration you can!
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