prob going to annoy alot of people

[phantom85]

after moving house i decided that i might as well go all out and do a dirted tank. got some worm compost from bunnings for $5/10kgs. read alot about how to minerilize topsoil and make worm safe for a tank. boiled the worm compost for about 5mins then left it outsdie on a tarp for a day to dry out, wet it again, dryed it. did this about 5 or 6 times. now comes the annoying part. set up the tank, put in some plants mainly swords, crypts, thin val and a bit of java moss.
day 1 = 0 ammonia
0 nitrite
0 nitrate

week one was the same so i decided to try out putting 3 corys, 10 mollies and my bn pleco in there

week 2 still the same, no algae bloom, nitrates are still undetectible so i thought why not throw in a few more fish so in go 5 guppys, 15 ghost shrimp and some water lettice

week 3 still nothing. i know i have read other posts about people dirting their tanks and have struggled with algae blooms, ammonia spikes and the like.
anyone got any ideas what i did right to fluke this one?

[hbosman]

You might not see change until week 6. I didn't use dirt but, it took my tank over 6 weeks to cycle.

[WoodShoe]

It took mine about 2 months. Then water turned to mountain dew over a period of 2 days... 3 days of darkness cleared it right up.

I used miracle grow (organic) and mixed it with a sand substrate to make my own soil. Seems to be working great, except my water has a bit of a yellow tinge to it. I assume its from the brown soil?.. hopefully it will go away eventually from doing water changes.

[150EH]

I think if you do it properly the result should be good, here's a link to the correct method by the people who started the whole thing. I know your are supposed to use plain top soil with no additives and most do understand that using MGOPS is not the same thing.

[phantom85]

well the tank has been set up for 8 weeks now and still not getting any noticible readings of ammonia, nitrite or nitrate. think i just fluked this one

[Hoppy]

When you mineralized the worm castings you converted all of the organic nitrogen to inorganic nitrogen - nitrates. Then the plants are eating all of the nitrates, so you don't see any in your testing. Also, nitrate test kits can indicate zero if they are not used exactly correctly. I would not expect you to see ammonia, with the plants and non-ammonia bearing worm castings.

[plantbrain]

Originally Posted by 150EH

I think if you do it properly the result should be good, here's a link to the correct method by the people who started the whole thing. I know your are supposed to use plain top soil with no additives and most do understand that using MGOPS is not the same thing.

Ummm, no, they did not start worm castings, this can be traced to Brazil aquarist who had few fertilizer options.

http://www.aquahobby.com/tanks/e_tank0311b.php

This picture predates the local club you refer too.


Soil also predates the Brazil club going back to Diana Walstad in her 1998 book.........which she had been doing all along for 10 years prior, and then before her, Dorothy Reimer.

Before that, many Europeans had done this and suggested sandy or clay loams.

It's like saying ADA invents using CO2, even though Dupla had done it years before(they made the same claim, they invented using it in the hobby), and then articles in TFH discussed it going back to 1962 at least and then in research back to the 1930's etc.

They did not invent it any more than I invented dosing fertilizers some particularly way, I promoted an idea that was already around and gave ample credit. I certainly did not invent PO4 dosing, or EI, or DSM, or a dozen other hairbrained things........facets where already done prior, I just felt they worked well.

Folks have used soil for MANY decades. This forum might not be aware of the history, it's not something readily avail on the web or on a specific web site.
History has a bad habit of repeating itself.

[Hoppy]

Could it be that Christopher Columbus brought worm castings, KNO3, KH2PO4, etc. with him when he visited the West Indies with his planted tanks? All I know for sure is that he didn't use LEDs to light his tanks.

Obviously I'm not quite ready to go on a TV talent show with my comedy act.

[chicken]

Originally Posted by Hoppy

Could it be that Christopher Columbus brought worm castings, KNO3, KH2PO4, etc. with him when he visited the West Indies with his planted tanks? All I know for sure is that he didn't use LEDs to light his tanks.

Obviously I'm not quite ready to go on a TV talent show with my comedy act.

Sorry, no, it was the Norse who did it first. People always seem to overlook their achievements.

But seriously, no one's saying that GWAPA invented the concept of using worm castings or soil in a tank. The "whole thing" that 150EH refers to is the recipe for Mineralized Topsoil Substrate, a specific method of using soil in a tank.

We appear to be talking about several different things in this thread.

Gravel, laterite, and worm castings (as in the Brazilian tank in the link provided above) is not Mineralized Topsoil Substrate. Neither is using potting soil or topsoil capped with sand or gravel, as in a Walstad style tank. Boiling is also not part of it. Not saying you shouldn't boil soil (or worm castings) --I really don't know. But it is a different process than putting soil through wet and dry cycles to allow bacteria to process the organic matter, and may very well yield a different result. It may work just fine, but it's not the same process or product

I'm also curious about the original poster's use of the term "worm compost." I notice that the OP is in Australia, so I don't know if the term means what it sounds like to me --worm poop, to put it bluntly-- or something more like organic potting soil or humus. I've never heard of worm castings as being sold in 10 kg bags. (But there's probably a lot of things I've never heard of.)

If people still want to argue over who did what first, that's fine. But let's at least define our terms, so we're arguing about the same thing.

To answer the OP's question: I don't know why you're not seeing algae blooms, ammonia spikes, and the like. I've had heavily planted tanks that never had to cycle, since the plants processed all the ammonia (not dirt tanks, though --haven't tried that yet). Keep an eye on things and keep us posted.

[phantom85]

the 'worm compost' i am refering to is a product that we get in aust that is pretty much compost that has been run through a worm farm or the like to break it down even more. think feeding compost to a worm farm and using the end result. could just be worm castings mixed with organic compost. dont know, the bag just said worm compost

[chicken]

Originally Posted by phantom85

the 'worm compost' i am refering to is a product that we get in aust that is pretty much compost that has been run through a worm farm or the like to break it down even more. think feeding compost to a worm farm and using the end result. could just be worm castings mixed with organic compost. dont know, the bag just said worm compost

Ah, thanks for the explanation. Sounds like it would be good for enriching garden soil.

[phantom85]

prob would be, it is working great in the tank. the plants are growning like crazy, swords have doubled in size in 6 weeks, crypts are bright red, my red ludwiga which was struggeling before has taken off. i have the worm compost as a base layer with root tabs, richgro aquatic potting mix (fossilised sea sponges according to the email i got from richgro when i asked them what the hell it was) top layer of black quartz. the plants might be growing like crazy but they aren't pearling.

[chicken]

Wow, sounds amazing.

OK, now you are annoying me (just kidding )