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 12-06-2011, 12:54 AM #31 rahlcepx516 Algae Grower   PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Ohio Posts: 100 Hm, so I used the calculator to calculate a solution of k2SO4 in 30ml doses in a 1000ml container for a 75 gallon tank. EI here states 1/4 tsp 3 times a week. Calculator says.... To reach your target of 8.5ppm K, you'll need to add 179.259 grams of K2SO4 into your 1000.0 mL container. Each 30.0 mL of that mix into 75.0 gal is: 179.259 grams = 12.1229358 US tablespoons I'm dosing twice as much k2SO4 versus KNO3? huh? (I had around 6.2 TBSP for my tank). I feel it should be more like 1.6 tablespoons...

12-06-2011, 01:35 AM   #32
Wasserpest
Are these real?

Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Monterey, CA
Posts: 14,818

Quote:
 Originally Posted by rahlcepx516 Hm, so I used the calculator to calculate a solution of k2SO4 in 30ml doses in a 1000ml container for a 75 gallon tank. EI here states 1/4 tsp 3 times a week. Calculator says.... To reach your target of 8.5ppm K, you'll need to add 179.259 grams of K2SO4 into your 1000.0 mL container. Each 30.0 mL of that mix into 75.0 gal is: 179.259 grams = 12.1229358 US tablespoons I'm dosing twice as much k2SO4 versus KNO3? huh? (I had around 6.2 TBSP for my tank). I feel it should be more like 1.6 tablespoons...
Plugging your values for KNO3 into the calculator, I get 131 grams. So it's not twice, and you need more K2SO4 to get the same K level than KNO3 to get the same N level. Not that it really matters.

One thing to watch out for is the solubility of K2SO4. You won't be able to dissolve 12 tbs K2SO4 into 1l water. My suggestion with a large tank like yours would be to dose dry, unless you auto-dose solutions.
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 12-06-2011, 08:07 AM #33 wet Algae Grower   PTrader: (2/100%) Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: US Posts: 112 Hi rahlcepx516 There's a couple of things going on here that I think may be confusing. 1) your solution has about 33 doses, so 1/4 tsp doses would be more like 2.75 TBL. 2) 1 tsp of K2SO4 is about 6.4 grams, so the calculator's suggested amount in solution is a little more than 9 TBL. 3) and most important is that there's more than one way to EI. Two examples: I don't think plantbrain even doses or recommends K2SO4 (instead just using K from KNO3) and the suggested amounts folk discuss are almost all scaled from a "typical high light" 20 gallon plantbrain mentioned in early EI docs. Notice where the calculator's 8.5 lppm falls in EI's recommended 10-30ppm K range. Also follow the long term modeling link and use EI's standard 50% weekly water changes, and you'll see what I mean about EI having huge ranges. The current calculator makes some assumptions in it's recommendation for EI. It suggests less N, more P, and more Fe than most because, well, I think it's smarter. It assumes if you are dosing a K source you're doing it because you are not getting K from any other sources. It doesn't do what the sticky here suggests, which knows you're getting some K from KNO3, KH2PO4 and GH booster. (this is how it calculates every nutrient, of course!) What I'm saying is EI is awesome in part because it tells us to stop caring so much about every nutrient but C. When aquarists first using EI think they're chasing some number or written-in-stone routine, they are missing one of the important points of EI. But check out http://alpha.calc.petalphile.com for EI doses that more strictly follows these circa 2005 recommendations folks are so married to . I think blocking on these points (while I think they're important) are stopping folks from moving past nutrients, which is the ultimate point of this calculator. Suggestions for another solution to this problem, or members telling me i'm wrong, or general discussion among gardeners are appreciated of course __________________ Let's all grow great tanks. petalphile.com
 12-06-2011, 01:02 PM #34 Gatekeeper Planted Tank VIP     PTrader: (93/100%) Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Earth Posts: 6,562 What about adding the ability in the selections under "DIY" section to add multiple chemicals to a solution and get a resultant? Such as the total value of K if one added KH2PO4, K2SO4 and KNO3 into solution. __________________
 12-06-2011, 06:07 PM #35 wet Algae Grower   PTrader: (2/100%) Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: US Posts: 112 Sure. Probably not this next release, but a future one. Folks wanting this now might be interested in pat w's Excel spreadsheet, which uses data from this calculator. You can find his current release here: http://www.aquaticplantenthusiasts.c...html#post28484 __________________ Let's all grow great tanks. petalphile.com
 12-06-2011, 07:15 PM #36 firefiend Planted Tank Obsessed     PTrader: (0/0%) Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Vancouver, WA Posts: 362 Hey wet... are there any plans for an android app which might possible also act as a "tank tracker" of sorts as well? that'd be super sweet.
 12-07-2011, 12:32 AM #37 wet Algae Grower   PTrader: (2/100%) Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: US Posts: 112 Hey firefiend. Not immediately but I'm pondering porting this over to another language that is more portable across devices. There's also the more likely possibility that it simply be an app available offline instead of a traditional App Store purchase. (I would prefer the latter in terms of my current interests.) Also keep in mind there's the regular mobile web interface at http://calc.petalphile.com/mobile Tell me more about this tank tracker idea. What is it you're looking for? A log to enter your doses and maybe get some charts and graphs back? A simple log/diary of your schedule you could export or paste into threads and stuff? Another idea? (If someone wants to tackle these projects -- and it does seem like folks want an Android dosing app -- I'd love to collaborate!) (Folks with Apple mobile devices who want an offline calc should check out Mistergreen's calculator, which also uses bits from this project: http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/miste...446259633?mt=8 ) __________________ Let's all grow great tanks. petalphile.com
 12-07-2011, 01:37 AM #38 mistergreen Bow ties are cool     PTrader: (12/100%) Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Cincinnati Posts: 13,286 Thanks for the advert I'm still working on version 2 of the app and it does track whatever you want to put in there. It has a week view. I'm stuck right now. There is a function in the tracker that lets you take a picture of your tank but the camera interface is being covered by another interface and I have to figure out how to get rid of it. __________________ DIY High Tech Tank forum http://aquatictechtank.net A forum dedicated to design and program aquatic tanks
 12-07-2011, 05:30 PM #39 esworp Planted Member     PTrader: (2/100%) Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Panama City Beach, FL Posts: 275 I dose dry, but dont have a scale that I can measure milligrams on. I'd like to make a feature request of dry doses in 1, 1/2, 1/4, 1/8, 1/16, and 1/32 teaspoons. (ie: Dash, Smidge, Pinch, etc minispoons..) __________________ Tank Stand Of The GODS AUT VIAM INVENIAM AUT FACIAM http://youtu.be/yYbRvNtj0U4?hd=1
12-07-2011, 07:42 PM   #40
Wasserpest
Are these real?

Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Monterey, CA
Posts: 14,818

Quote:
 Originally Posted by wet Also keep in mind there's the regular mobile web interface at http://calc.petalphile.com/mobile
This would work great on android if the keyboard would pop up for number entries. It works in the non-mobile version. Any way to fix?
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12-07-2011, 07:54 PM   #41
firefiend
Planted Tank Obsessed

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Vancouver, WA
Posts: 362

Quote:
 Originally Posted by wet Tell me more about this tank tracker idea. What is it you're looking for? A log to enter your doses and maybe get some charts and graphs back? A simple log/diary of your schedule you could export or paste into threads and stuff? Another idea?

So, I'm going to be developing a spreadsheet to track my tanks progress... what I'm going to be entering are my water testing results; my fert dosing (if any); lighting info (PAR, watts, distance, etc.); excel dosing, etc. I don't use CO2 on my tanks but that could also be added and tracked.

from the testing results and dosing info you can estimate plant uptake; graph it, etc.

I'm not sure this is all useful to the typical hobbyist but I want to learn cause and effect and I'm looking to gather and present as much data as possible. And while I don't necessary need a mobile app; I just thought it would be cool and gives you a great project for either freeware or an opportunity to generate a little income.

 12-07-2011, 08:20 PM #42 esworp Planted Member     PTrader: (2/100%) Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Panama City Beach, FL Posts: 275 I have a spreadsheet for your use if you want.. PM me. Also, +1 to the idea of a decent android app. :] __________________ Tank Stand Of The GODS AUT VIAM INVENIAM AUT FACIAM http://youtu.be/yYbRvNtj0U4?hd=1
 12-07-2011, 10:29 PM #43 wet Algae Grower   PTrader: (2/100%) Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: US Posts: 112 Thanks for these suggestions and requests! esworp, You've been able to use fractions in the teaspoon fields for some time now. Just enter 1/16 (or whatever) into the appropriate field: Wasserpest, Yes, but I'm not really sure how to do it right now. The problem is every mobile device I've ever tested (including flip phones) is usable on the mobile interface. For example, here's all three Android devices I could borrow from coworkers just now, all with the keyboard displayed on the mobile calculator: http://cdn.petalphile.com/stuff/android_yanc.png I need to find one that fails before understanding why this is happening to your telephone machine. Or maybe I or someone else will get around to the Android project sooner than I plan! firefiend, I like your and esworp's project idea. It sounds like a cool spreadsheet and I hope you find time to share it with other gardeners. Thanks again. __________________ Let's all grow great tanks. petalphile.com
12-07-2011, 11:01 PM   #44
mistergreen
Bow ties are cool

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 13,286

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Wasserpest This would work great on android if the keyboard would pop up for number entries. It works in the non-mobile version. Any way to fix?
You can specify the keyboard type in an app, at least in the iphone version. You can't really with a web app like wet's since it's html/javascript. It can't communicate straight to the mobile's operating system.
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 12-07-2011, 11:15 PM #45 Gatekeeper Planted Tank VIP     PTrader: (93/100%) Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Earth Posts: 6,562 Keyboard didn't show for my HTC incredible. __________________

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