Excel as a treatment for BBA? Experiences?

[ThomE]

motifone,

Not to throw a wrench in this thread. But looking at the pic, you sure it isn't spot algae?

Anyway, I started dosing excel also. Somebody told me it helps with the iron uptake too. So, I guess one product with many trades.

[motifone]

ThomE,

No problem. My pictures are somewhat deceiving because the algae is not far along. It does seem though to be the beginnings of BBA -- it's not threads, but little black marks, like pieces of ash. What gives it away is as BBA is its preference for growing along the leave edges (like a fringe), on the surface of leaves, and the color, black.

I have some green spot algae as well, which is more green and circular. Here's another picture of BBA (NOT from my tank), but some of my worse-off Tenellus leaves had progressed to about 70% of this point:



There's some other pictures and other good info here:

http://www.plantgeek.net/article_viewer.php?id=9

[PeteyPob]

I have the exact same thing as Monitfone,
It is on the edges of my pigmys,stallatas, glosso. I am also starting to develop this brown algae on plants(dont know where this is coming from). You can tell spot algae from BBA, I have spot algae too and its green compared to the BBA. Hummm I seem to have built a collection of plants AND algae .
Pete

[motifone]

Hi gang,

Any updates on results or is it too soon to ask? Be sure to include what you dosed -- as directed, 2x, 3x, etc.

Does it actually wither/dissolve away older pieces of BBA or just prevents a spread?

[Momotaro]

I finished my 14 day cycle last week. The BBA, as far as I can tell, is all gone.

Mike

[Vinlo]

I am thinking of using this method on some thread algae I just can't shake. I guess no one has done this long enough ago to know if it is just a band aid or an actual cure?

[motifone]

Mike

Thanks for the promising update.

I will proceed, with caution. I think I'll progressively increase my dosage over the first three days -- as prescribed on day 1, 2x on day 2, 3x on day 3 -- and then leveling off at 3x the dose for the remainder of the 14 days.

[Momotaro]

I would just dose 3x the product from the get go.

Do it right after your water change. Dose the first dose per Excel instructions for a first dose (1 capful or 5ml per 10G). The initial Excel dose after a water change is usually a high dose anyway, so you might as well continue from there.

Mike

[mr hyde]

I've had a serious case of BBA for about 6 months and am currently on day 6 of the excel treatment. Just like the other folks mentioned, most of the bba has turned red and seems to have stopped growing. I'm hoping it dies off. One thing I noticed is that since it's turned red my siamese algae eaters eat the older algae instead of only the new smaller bba. They grab onto it and twist and turn until it rips off.

[Curare]

So it goes red when it's starting to croak?

Ahhh

I see.

Is it possible that we're actually making things a lot harder than they have to be?

I mean, take a look at what Tom Barr has proscribed in the past.

B/G algae - low-no nitrates
G/W - high levels of ammonia.
green algae - increase phosphates

Surely then we must assume that BBA is a sign of some other water parameter not being right, right?

What does excel contain that's helping the fight?

What levels are over the top or limitng plant growth?

I think this is the proper way to address the algae situation don't you?

[motifone]

ok, I'm slightly confused... maybe you guys can lend a hand. Per Seachem's website, normal dosing of Excel is as follows:

"On initial use or after a major (>Ê40%) water change, use 1 capful (5 mL) for every 40 L (10 gallons*). Thereafter use 1Êcapful (5ml) for every 200 L (50 gallons*) daily or every other day."

When determining a 2x or 3x dose for my 50 gallon tank, which of the above dosage rules do I go by? If I go by the 1Êcapful (5ml) for every 50 gallons, then a 2x dose for my 50g would be 10ml and a 3x dose for my 50g would be 15ml? Yes? I will assume these are daily doses, not every other day.

I can't figure out how some of you folks arrived at doses like 25ml for a 75g as mentioned in this thread, or others I've read like, 15ml in a 30g, or 30ml in a 18g.

Basically, what would you recommend as 2x and 3x dosages for my 50g? Also, should I expect cloudiness during the treatment? If so, do I stick to my normal once a week water change routine or do a special "emergency" partial water change?

thanks!!

[Jason Baliban]

I just finished a 10 day cycle of excell. I have to tell you things look much better. There is still some bba on plants that where really effected. I seems to have stopped growing, so now I just trim the old leaves bit by bit. I wish that I had a control to see if it was really the excell or me finally getting my ferts in order. Either way, I think that it the excell has a lot to do with it, considering all the positive results that folks are having. Motifone, I have a 46 gallon tank. I dosed around 15 or so ml of excell per day. I experienced no cloudyness and some of my red plants got really red, which was a nice bonus. Also, no ill effects to my fish.
jB

[aquaverde]

Originally Posted by Curare

So it goes red when it's starting to croak?

Ahhh

I see.

Is it possible that we're actually making things a lot harder than they have to be?

I mean, take a look at what Tom Barr has proscribed in the past.

B/G algae - low-no nitrates
G/W - high levels of ammonia.
green algae - increase phosphates

Surely then we must assume that BBA is a sign of some other water parameter not being right, right?

What does excel contain that's helping the fight?

What levels are over the top or limitng plant growth?

I think this is the proper way to address the algae situation don't you?

Tom Barr’s prescription for BBA is high CO2 levels, so for a CO2-injected tank, BBA control is accomplished by maintaining 30ppm CO2. In a non-CO2 tank, this can’t be done, but lower light levels and healthy plants help to keep things in balance.

Keeping the CO2 high prevents BBA from growing. It is a very persistent algae, and there are stories of aquarists removing infested driftwood and placing it in the dark for 6 months and having the BBA come right back after it was returned to an aquarium. Physical removal is part of the routine for getting rid of this stuff, and that includes infected leaves on plants. Excel will kill it, and possibly save your plants. Also, bleach will kill it (chorine or peroxide) but those methods are a bit dicey. Some aquarists have reported good success controlling BBA outbreaks by using Excel, and it’s a better option in some cases.

DIY CO2 tanks are especially susceptible to BBA because (and this comes from Barr- I’m no plant scientist) BBA can take advantage of the fluctuating levels of carbon in the tank, whereas plants are less successful. So fluctuating CO2 is a condition that will favor BBA. For this reason, Tom Barr advises not to do regular water changes on non-CO2 injected tanks. Tap water generally has high levels of dissolved CO2, and regular water changes can actually trigger BBA because it will temporarily raise CO2 levels.

[plantbrain]

Originally Posted by Curare

I mean, take a look at what Tom Barr has proscribed in the past.

B/G algae - low-no nitrates
G/W - high levels of ammonia.
green algae - increase phosphates

Surely then we must assume that BBA is a sign of some other water parameter not being right, right?

What does excel contain that's helping the fight?
I think this is the proper way to address the algae situation don't you?

Yes, think BBA=> low CO2.
Adding Excel= adds carbon and relieves the need for CO2.

Pretty straight forward.
Now try this with Cladophora(green hair algae- has branches)
I'm on 12 weeks with it and excel, no effect, I did melt some Lagarosiphon madagascarensis though.......

I can stop BBA growing by adding enough CO2.

I do not need it to die, I just need the algae to stop growing.
From there I can prune it off.

Regards,
Tom Barr

[shalu]

Originally Posted by plantbrain

Now try this with Cladophora(green hair algae- has branches)
I'm on 12 weeks with it and excel, no effect, I did melt some Lagarosiphon madagascarensis though.......

I have the green hair algae in my low maint 10 gallon. That's about the only algae I have there, on the gravel. I don't intentionally overdose Excel to kill algae, not yet, just dose 5-10ml Excel once a week. Just pour straight in, no accurate measurements. I noticed SOME of the hair algae died and turned black, not sure if it is due to Excel. My Lagarosiphon madagascarensis is still beautiful though.