Sump System Design
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Old 12-12-2012, 02:46 PM   #1
Gatekeeper
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Default Sump System Design

Hello my fellow planted tankers. I am looking to do something different and give sump filtration a try, but would like to compile some guidance documents for review. Google is great and all, and I am a search engine junky, but I also feel that you need to go directly to a viable source sometimes and I was hoping some of you have a library of info I can tap from.

First off, the tank is NOT drilled, but I plan on doing so. I have reviewed many types of plumbing configurations and I think I like the Beananimal setup the best. It seems to provide ample security, while providing the most efficient and quiet filtration. I am not 100% sure how it will be drilled into the tank yet, but some type of overflow box will be created.

So, please help me by providing some of the best guidance documents or videos you may have to help me size and design the system.

Lets start with the following:

Sump Size: I am looking at a relatively decent bio load, but moderatly planted. I was thinking maybe an 18 gallon tank? I do have a 20 tall already, but looking at how my stand is built, the 20 tall would eat up a lot of height and the plumbing I think would be a nightmare. 20 long is too big for the stand. Any suggestions?? Something simple is fine, doesn't need to be pretty.

Pumps and turnover rate: This is a maddening topic and I don't want to get to vested into brands and types. This can be a very user biased opinion and I am willing to try a a few options, but some basic links and suggestions would be fine for me. Really my main question is, what would be an ample turnover rate.

Plumbing: Any good links on sizing would be great. I am always in awe of the reefers and their elaborate plumbing setups and wonder where all their inspirations come from. Obviously reef filtration is a bit more exotic than what I need, but any tutorials or good links would be beneficial! I always like looking at options.

Any feedback you guys can provide would be great. Thanks!
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Old 12-12-2012, 03:22 PM   #2
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WOW thats quite a list you got there

now I will add this and let others chime in for the rest...

Look up as many threads on diffrent sump types and ask ?s of those sumps there so you get it from the makers mouth or the person who bought it.

You can see allot of working diy examples on Youtube

Sump size: This realy depends on what you are gonna put in the sump, type of filtration, under display space,the overall water of the display, the drainage amount when siphon breaks, the amount of water going into the sump and returning into display.

I typicaly go with @ least 30% of water in display ( 10G for 29G or 20H for 55G)

yes you do have to consider all the space avialable under the display inside the cabinet

I typically use diy bucket trickle tower going into sump, some have flow/refugium partitions where I have dwarf shrimps/ fry.

Turnover rate depends if the return pump is the only means of circulation. around 8x is fine for me.

Drilling glass is easy on tanks using anything 1/8"+ thick glass

let us know more details as you start getting closer on your sump design
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Old 12-12-2012, 04:19 PM   #3
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Great start Joe, Thanks. I have and am still going through numerous DIY sump ideas and am still considering options.

I am going to dry fit the 20 gallon tall in the tank tonight and see if this is viable option (even though at first look, it doesn't look like something ideal).

May consider building a acrylic sump....
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Old 12-12-2012, 06:43 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatekeeper View Post
May consider building a acrylic sump....

Here is a pic of a sump I built out of 1/4" cell cast acrylic (+28 operational gallons) .

I used left over acrylic to make side bracing even though the eurobracing and the acrylic partition was more than enough to keep it from bowing.

I wanted to maximize all the space under the 40B display tank. It has 2 durso'd gravity feed drains one goes to a trickle tower with 3 gallon of wet-dri media and the other goes to a micron sock/ carbon media chamber. both are a breeze to maintian.

the other pic is a diy sump using a 2gallon bucket (1.5gallon wetdri media) held in place by a siliconed glass partition and 10G tank rim. it has mangrove pods, heater, almond leaves in the back and I diy hood powering a 3x3w led bulb.

its not dificult to weldon arcylic panes together.

look up UaruJoey on youtube or better yet--->
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYhfV7SvoRs

This man is brilliant!
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Old 12-12-2012, 06:07 PM   #5
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How to calculate head loss, old so newer pumps aren't on. Note how adding elbows and height seriously changes things. My pumps are labeled 1500 and 780 gph which is well over the 1800 gph I would like but with head loss I am getting an estimated 1200 gph. If you have a CO2 reactor on the system that is 2 90* elbows plus whatever it takes to get it plumbed in, at least 2 more 90* elbows. Search Reef Central for info on the quietest pumps and remember to consider efficiency as some pumps are monsters for flow and don't cost much but are expensive to run. Pumps run 24 hours a day unlike lights and heaters.
http://reefcentral.com/calc/hlc2.php
I ended up with a Laguna MaxFlo [a pond pump that comes in a space age looking cage] but Rio Hyperflow was on the short list as well. Have had good experiences with the Rios unlike reef keepers and they come with a wide array of attachments which come in handy.

I am sure you have seen this but here is BeanAnimal's page on his design.
http://www.beananimal.com/projects/s...ow-system.aspx

Sumps don't need much servicing. I don't even have batting to replace. I wonder if you put the 20 tall on a plank so it can slide in and out when mostly empty of water it would be easier to deal with? Then you could clean out the pump, get the mulm out, get sponges out to rinse and such.

If you are running a lot of water through the overflow then use a flat overflow with no teeth. My 17" long overflow with equally spaced teeth couldn't handle anything near all the water I wanted to go through the system so I broke most of them out and now the pump is barely choked back.

MFK members use sumps a lot. Might look through the info on that forum.
http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/
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Old 12-12-2012, 08:06 PM   #6
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Default Thanks Kathyy


Hey Kathyy great info BTW
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Old 12-12-2012, 08:55 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kathyy View Post
How to calculate head loss, old so newer pumps aren't on. Note how adding elbows and height seriously changes things. My pumps are labeled 1500 and 780 gph which is well over the 1800 gph I would like but with head loss I am getting an estimated 1200 gph. If you have a CO2 reactor on the system that is 2 90* elbows plus whatever it takes to get it plumbed in, at least 2 more 90* elbows. Search Reef Central for info on the quietest pumps and remember to consider efficiency as some pumps are monsters for flow and don't cost much but are expensive to run. Pumps run 24 hours a day unlike lights and heaters.
http://reefcentral.com/calc/hlc2.php
I ended up with a Laguna MaxFlo [a pond pump that comes in a space age looking cage] but Rio Hyperflow was on the short list as well. Have had good experiences with the Rios unlike reef keepers and they come with a wide array of attachments which come in handy.

I am sure you have seen this but here is BeanAnimal's page on his design.
http://www.beananimal.com/projects/s...ow-system.aspx

Sumps don't need much servicing. I don't even have batting to replace. I wonder if you put the 20 tall on a plank so it can slide in and out when mostly empty of water it would be easier to deal with? Then you could clean out the pump, get the mulm out, get sponges out to rinse and such.

If you are running a lot of water through the overflow then use a flat overflow with no teeth. My 17" long overflow with equally spaced teeth couldn't handle anything near all the water I wanted to go through the system so I broke most of them out and now the pump is barely choked back.

MFK members use sumps a lot. Might look through the info on that forum.
http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/
Thanks for all the great links Kathyy. I missed your post before somehow. I have seen most of the links you posted. I need to look into the 20 tall....will follow up with more info on that soon.
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Old 12-12-2012, 07:12 PM   #8
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Those are excellent. Yes, I watched all of uarujoey's vid's (subscriber) and that is where a lot of my ideas started from.

I have been forum stalking for a while and it seems that most of my thoughts just need to be drawn up and put into a specification format for me to list.

I see a lot of people using 10 gallon aquariums as sumps, and honestly, for my needs that may be sufficient, however, I am going to put some thought into building my own out of acrylic. I need to investigate pricing on this a bit more since it doesn't seem to be the most cost effective approach from the limited research I have done to date.
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Old 12-12-2012, 07:43 PM   #9
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I think diy acrylic is only cost effective when you want to maxime the space inside the cabinet under the display tank and you have a unique partition setup for your refugium/filtration needs.

but imo for any thing 29G or less I would buy a 10G tank $10 a 2 gallon bucket with lid$5
plastic dollar store pot scrubbers $3-5. glass sheet from HD or glass shop for partitions $3-$12 (depends on the # of glass partitions), PLastic cealing light bulb fixture $1.25, dollar store 6foot extention(for the sump light) $1. a cfl screw bulb 13watt $9 for 4pk @ hd. a 350GPH pump $20-35 and bulkheads you can get cheap from these ebay sellers based in texas (forgot thier name) HD for 1" and 1/2" plumbing

any who even with all the $ in the aforementioned parts its still cheaper than the cell cast acrylic alone and then you still need to order all the other stuff
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Old 12-12-2012, 09:17 PM   #10
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keep us updated!, i do so love a good sump build
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