I have a cheaper seems to be generic type lower end regulator. It costs around 70 bucks. I am running a higher than normal pressure to run my green leaf diffuser which is working out great.:icon_cool The problem is I am getting some float from the pressure & I notice some dosage seems to vary a little. I am a little concerned that if I am away I could gas my fish, because if I keep my Kh set at 3 & ideal dosage of 1 bubble every 3 second seems to work out well , however I have caught the ph dipping below 6.4 on occasion even though 6.6 is the norm. I run a solenoid as well.
I guess what I want is a little more control with the dosage with a finer needle valve. Are they expensive & how difficult are they to install. Are there some regulators that cannot be upgraded this way?
My budget is low & I already have put way too much money already than expected so if it costs more than 100 bucks I will pass on it, because I have a 55 sitting an waiting for pressurized CO2 right now , but still saving & planning for the set up. Suggestions would be great.
Depends on whether you can find good deals or not; there are sometimes good deals on eBay, but you have to be patient. They are relatively easy to install if you have the correct tools.
Some commercially available regulators use products (such as Loctite) that will essentially glue components together. These can be extremely difficult to remove.
My budget is low & I already have put way too much money already than expected so if it costs more than 100 bucks I will pass on it, because I have a 55 sitting an waiting for pressurized CO2 right now , but still saving & planning for the set up. Suggestions would be great.
A Fabco NV-55-18 runs around $40, brand new, I believe. You could get the Ideal 52-1-11 for around $75-80, brand new. Alternatively, as I mentioned previously, searching eBay will sometimes yield much cheaper results.
Thanks Anthony. I was wondering , it looks like there is some locking cement on the threads , but it appears whitish in color. Can I turn it off from the outer locking nut which is located just behind the adjustment knob? A new needle valve assembly would just replace that whole section including the part that holds the tubing as well? or just the outer locknut where the dial is located?
The 40 dollar range sounds like the better deal in my case. Thanks again
Can I turn it off from the outer locking nut which is located just behind the adjustment knob? A new needle valve assembly would just replace that whole section including the part that holds the tubing as well? or just the outer locknut where the dial is located?
You may be able to find cheaper options if you are patient on eBay. The $40 for the Fabco NV-55 is what I was quoted for a brand-new, retail priced valve.
Anthony the whitish material looks more transparent on the threads. I will try an download a picture but my cheap point & shoot which actually takes pretty good images just eats batteries, so it may be difficult getting an image to you quickly,
However I can try & describe it better. All it looks like is a T that comes off the left side directly off the central hub if you will of the regulator. The top part of the T there is a fitting that the CO2 tube is delivered to the solenoid. Looking just left of the T there is a small hex nut & then the dial itself for adjusting the flow.
Does the needle valve go in that part or does the whole T have to come out & be replaced as an assembly?? Once again looking right now you have adjusting knob then hex nut connecting to the T pointing up which goes to the solenoid, then extending with threads directly to the regulator, this is where I noticed some kind of solvent that is clear looking. Not tape.
Thats it: My guess is that small hex needs to come out to get at the needle valve & then replace with new one.
You asked about which needle I have & I cannot find manufacturer label anywhere on the regulator or needle valve. Looks like no name bran.
Anthony the whitish material looks more transparent on the threads. I will try an download a picture but my cheap point & shoot which actually takes pretty good images just eats batteries, so it may be difficult getting an image to you quickly,
It could still be teflon tape; after it gets used, I find that it does turn transparent. In any case, a photo would be much more helpful, particularly for the next part.
However I can try & describe it better. All it looks like is a T that comes off the left side directly off the central hub if you will of the regulator. The top part of the T there is a fitting that the CO2 tube is delivered to the solenoid. Looking just left of the T there is a small hex nut & then the dial itself for adjusting the flow.
This sounds like there is an additional valve for adjusting flow, in addition to the regulator. You can probably remove this to clean up the appearance.
Does the needle valve go in that part or does the whole T have to come out & be replaced as an assembly?? Once again looking right now you have adjusting knob then hex nut connecting to the T pointing up which goes to the solenoid, then extending with threads directly to the regulator, this is where I noticed some kind of solvent that is clear looking. Not tape.
Thats it: My guess is that small hex needs to come out to get at the needle valve & then replace with new one.
A photo is needed. If it is an actual T, then the needle valve can go into the T. In general, needle valves go after the solenoid as well, so I am unsure exactly what kind of setup you have.
As requested. Whats going on? Can this be upgraded with a better needle valve? Sorry, I should have put the camera on macro but it is good enough for demonstration purposes. What do you think Anthony?
you can take out the NPT to air hose connector, connect a solenoid to the so call "needle valve", then a real usable needle valve or metering valve to the solenoid.
to find the right parts for our co2 system is a big task, not anything call a "regulator", "needle valve" or "solenoid" and you assume they would get the job done.
The picture is blurry, but if that is the best you have, then I can work with that.
The "T" you describe appears to be the needle valve with a black phenolic knob.
The tubing feeds directly into a solenoid? I suppose your solenoid has some kind of NPT to hose barb adapters.
I am guessing that that from the solenoid, it goes to the bubble counter in the background, which then feeds into your aquarium.
You will need to remove the "T" (needle valve) if you are going to replace it. You might as well take this opportunity to place the solenoid first, and then the needle valve. You may also want to take this opportunity to fix up the wiring on the solenoid, as from what I can see the (green) wires are dangling about, and this can be dangerous.
Those green wires you talk about are just support wires to hold the solenoid in place. It is not a hazard! it keeps the hot solenoid from melting the CO2 tubes! You even talked about this solenoid yourself the 1 that gets hot. I read your thread on CO2. This tank was never designed to impress people nor any thought was put into the layout. It was intended as an experiment to see what I needed to do to grow plants in my horrid water that comes out of my tap. That being said after trial an error I figured out what needs to be done & the tank has started to grow on me:smile: Now I am ready for a bigger display since I have the plants down.
I am not sure if this solenoid can be screwed into regulators? Are there solenoids that are inline only? I would have to measure the threads on both reg, & solenoid. Either way it is not important that the solenoid even be attached to the regulator, although if higher end needle valves need to be attached to the solenoid that would be a different story. If it could be attached I would prefer to since it has a cleaner look, but all this stuff will some day be inside a cabinet & it will not be seen anyway. The higher end regulators have attached solenoids which look nicer. My next regulator will have it attached , but for now it is not that important as long as the needle valve would screw directly into the solenoid.
So to answer my question, can I screw a needle valve directly into this regulator if I cannot screw the solenoid first into the regulator first? Sounds like you are saying that the T screws out. Any chance the regulator casing could crack since it is a casting? Thanks again
Those green wires you talk about are just support wires to hold the solenoid in place. It is not a hazard! it keeps the hot solenoid from melting the CO2 tubes! You even talked about this solenoid yourself the 1 that gets hot. I read your thread on CO2.
I am not sure if this solenoid can be screwed into regulators? Are there solenoids that are inline only? I would have to measure the threads on both reg, & solenoid. Either way it is not important that the solenoid even be attached to the regulator, although if higher end needle valves need to be attached to the solenoid that would be a different story. If it could be attached I would prefer to since it has a cleaner look, but all this stuff will some day be inside a cabinet & it will not be seen anyway. The higher end regulators have attached solenoids which look nicer. My next regulator will have it attached , but for now it is not that important as long as the needle valve would screw directly into the solenoid.
If your solenoid is the Clippard, it is able to be mounted to the regulator. You can run solenoids inline, but I don't see why go to the extra trouble when it already has 1/8" NPT ports. Check your solenoid model number to see what ports it has (check the specification sheet); in all likelihood, it has 1/8" female NPT ports, while your regulator has 1/4" NPT ports, so you will need to get an adapter (a few dollars).
In general, needle valves are attached downstream of the solenoid (take a look at my guide for some helpful pictures).
If you are going to replace your current needle valve, you might as well fix up your solenoid as well, so it will look neat and tidy.
So to answer my question, can I screw a needle valve directly into this regulator if I cannot screw the solenoid first into the regulator first? Sounds like you are saying that the T screws out. Any chance the regulator casing could crack since it is a casting? Thanks again
You can connect the solenoid to the regulator first (in fact, you should). The needle valve then goes after the solenoid. Your current needle valve (the "T") should be able to be unscrewed from the regulator.
Regarding the regulator casing (? I am not sure what you are referring to here; the regulator body? Or are you referring to the gauges?): The body itself will not crack. The plastic covering the gauges can crack, but only if you are not careful.
You will (likely) need a bench vise and the appropriate sized wrench to take off the current needle valve.
Some fittings (brass or stainless steel, your choice) will be required to connect the solenoid to the regulator, and then the new (or your current) needle valve to the solenoid.
Yep that helped answering all the questions.
I was wondering if the gas company would have the fittings needed maybe even the needle valve but I guess looking around E bay & the internet will help to get a better price than the gas company. Probably would not hurt since they could provide the fittings & I could check out their needle valves for info anyway. I am sure their prices would be higher.
I will check out your threads on CO2 to further educate myself on the solenoids & regulators. Thanks Anthony for your time spent. You have been very helpful. Roger
I just put together my first regulator and i ordered my needle valve directly off the fabco site. It was the fabco nv-55 18 and i got if for $44 with shipping. I got all the fittings i needed to put this together from my local lowes and home depot. I used watts brass fittings and they are only a couple bucks a piece.
Thanks FIRSTMR: That's a good idea, I will check their fittings out. A new problem I discovered with my setup is the Clippard solenoid runs so hot I am not sure if it would even be a good idea to connect directly to the regulator? It may not be a problem with the heat need another opinion on that . If the soleniod heats up the regulator a little I am wondering if it would be bad for the system. Another issue is with the addition of the clippard solenoid + new needle valve or even the current stock needle valve I would have a long extension of metal hanging out to the side. Probably not that bad, but for me I do not have a standard cabinet to store all my equipment on my set up. Like I said it is more of a science project than display even though I spend too many hours each day looking at it.:icon_cool I guess I should not complain the regulator was given to me by a friend & I believe it costs about 70-80 bucks compared to $200-250, regulators you get what you pay for, however it makes a good starter system for people who want to get into a pressurized CO2 system for less money. I guess I could find an elbow & a straight to make it work. Thanks
A new problem I discovered with my setup is the Clippard solenoid runs so hot I am not sure if it would even be a good idea to connect directly to the regulator? It may not be a problem with the heat need another opinion on that .
Another issue is with the addition of the clippard solenoid + new needle valve or even the current stock needle valve I would have a long extension of metal hanging out to the side. Probably not that bad, but for me I do not have a standard cabinet to store all my equipment on my set up.
Can I unscrew the T needle valve assembly as 1 unit while mounted on the tank? The reason I ask this is I am not sure if I have a bench vise or not. If there will be a high risk of damage to the tank or regulator I could take it to a friends house instead.
you can take out the NPT to air hose connector, connect a solenoid to the so call "needle valve", then a real usable needle valve or metering valve to the solenoid.
I'm very much interested in why you say it should be mounted before needle valve. What are the con\pro's of mounting either way.
Inline it seems would be more convenient and easy to swap out, with little downtime should the solenoid need replacing. Especially for hobbyist that may not be so technically inclined.
I'm very much interested in why you say it should be mounted before needle valve. What are the con\pro's of mounting either way.
Inline it seems would be more convenient and easy to swap out, with little downtime should the solenoid need replacing. Especially for hobbyist that may not be so technically inclined.
To place a needle valve before the solenoid is fine only if the cavity volume between the needle valve and the solenoid is small, so with only limited amount of pressurized air in this cavity. once the solenoid open, it doesn't "push" too much to the rest of the air hose space or create trouble.
Anthony, the blurry picture is called camera shake! Even with dirty glasses I can see what is needed to see. I did not want to use my flash. Setting up a tripod was too much of a PITA ! Sounds like the sky is falling!
I agree that the solenoid should be placed in front of the needle valve. But not for safety reasons. I read some of the dangers about CO2 systems & feel they are not that valid. For 1, a check valve failure is not happening. Also , I have watched systems with no pressure either CO2 or air stones & the water never comes back down anyway. Is it possible, yes, but I have not seen water come back down & if it did the check valve would catch it.
If the CO2 tank leaked it would most likely leak slowly unless the tubing broke or solenoid failed which would be slow anyway because the needle valve would release the gas at slower rate than if the entire tank was outgassed! I have 1500 square feet with many house plants & central air. If there was a big leak at night & I did not feel good I would know fast in the tank area. Even if the tank leaked all out at 1 time & I was asleep it would not kill me. Too many square feet! If I stayed in the room long enough I would know the symptoms, it would not flatten me fast.
I believe you are being too critical about the solenoid position. From an aesthetic point of view it has its advantages, & yes its a little safer, & also (harder for some people to replace the solenoid as mentioned). I ran a pressurized system before this for 3 years without a problem & even bigger house, 2000 square feet with leaky windows. I never thought twice about it!
Besides, there is still a needle valve in place so the C02 would only leak out from the cylinder as fast as the needle valve would let it. All the threads on this website & not 1 mention of people being killed or got sick. You want to talk about dangerous. I think the DIY are more dangerous. I had CO2 leaking all day & night for 3 months in my tank room because the way I was running it & not once did I feel sick. Now if you have a small apartment that is under 700 square feet or less with a 20 lb tank you should take more precautions .
My 3 cents.
Anthony, the blurry picture is called camera shake! Even with dirty glasses I can see what is needed to see. I did not want to use my flash. Setting up a tripod was too much of a PITA ! Sounds like the sky is falling!
A clear photo will not leave any ambiguity about your setup; this is why I initially thought the green support frame were the flying leads from the solenoid.
I read some of the dangers about CO2 systems & feel they are not that valid. For 1, a check valve failure is not happening. Also , I have watched systems with no pressure either CO2 or air stones & the water never comes back down anyway. Is it possible, yes, but I have not seen water come back down & if it did the check valve would catch it.
While you may not have observed this phenomenon, it does occur. Plastic check valves can harden and become brittle with time, thus allowing water to flow back through the tubing and into the bubble counter/needle valve/solenoid.
A good inline check valve, as well as a regulator mounted check valve (i.e. directly after your needle valve (and before a mounted bubble counter, if you are using one) is ideal.
I believe you are being too critical about the solenoid position. From an aesthetic point of view it has its advantages, & yes its a little safer, & also (harder for some people to replace the solenoid as mentioned).
I have never once mentioned that pressurized CO2 was dangerous, provided that the proper safety precautions are taken. You can easily vent an entire cylinder of CO2 (say, 20 pound), and will be completely fine, unless you live in an airtight room.
The comments that I made were based on the thread attachments at the end of Bettatail last comments, they are located at the bottom of my picture. He brings up some valid concerns about safety but they seem exaggerated.
After reading them I felt like I had a dangerous chemical that at any time could kill, which it could but not likely . It was almost funny because I had a CO2 DIY venting directly in my small study room for 3 months & never felt sick! I will not go back into it since I have already said my opinion which could also be wrong.
I think what has brought some confusion to me & maybe others is if they bought an older regulator without a solenoid it could be a little daunting to install which was not the case for me but I could see it being a problem for some. My solenoid came in the ( inline form ) if I stand corrected meaning hex nuts able to be attached at both ends ( not directly to the solenoid ). Until learning from you Anthony I did not even realize that the solenoid does belong attached to the regulator. Recently I started to look around to buy another regulator for a bigger tank & I noticed most regulators come now with built in solenoids. Seems like the way to go. The further downstream not attached to the solenoid works though, I know because I have been running it that way for years without a problem, but I can see a need for at least 2 check valves. In a matter of fact , I agree with what you said & feel most systems should have 2 check valves or more pending on what the configuration is.
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