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Jeffrey's "Big Boy"---120g Planted: Updated 1/24/2022 w/ pictures

52K views 156 replies 55 participants last post by  jmhart 
#1 · (Edited)
Well, it's finally time. I've been talking about it and planning it out for a year(Evidenced: here, here, here, and here ) and now it's finally coming together, my 120g planted. To read a fair amount of background on me and my planted tanks, and especially the details leading up to this 120g, you can check out the link to my blog in my sig.

I've been waiting to put up a journal until things were starting to move a little quicker, and now the speed is picking up. I'm taking my time on this one, doing everything right from the get go, but there should start to be some action in the coming weeks.

For now, a little teaser shot:

 
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#2 · (Edited)
The tank is a 120g Marineland, 48"x24"x24", with a 700 gph corner overflow. I will most likely be removing the overflow and simply using the exisiting holes as the intake and output for my filtration system. There will be one input from the overflow hole. Output will either be entirely by a substrate level spray bar similar to BryceM's, or the substrate level spray bar plus two glass lily outputs.

The stand is maple, custom built. I've built plenty of stands before, some that even passed as decent(see the first post here), but for this I wanted professional furniture grade. After getting the thing home, it's apparent that I could have easily done the stand because most of the trim is prefab from a woodworking store like Rockler, but the canopy was the real gem du jour. The canopy is very solid, and incorporates a nice design to minimize light from shining through the seams. That was important to me and I couldn't have duplicated it unless I blatantly ripped off the cabinet maker.

The filtration will be a closed loop system similar to Scolley's, but incorporating three canister filters instead of his seperate pump/filtration modules. I will also be incorporating an auto water change similar to Sergio's.

Lighting will be a 6x54w Tek T5HO with 3 Giessman Middays and 3 Aquafloras. CO2 pressurized with a pH controller.

Finally, the whole thing will be controlled by a Wasser-controller.

These projects will be completed in the very near future. In consideration for expansion, I'll be building my piping with additional connections for a furture perstaltic pump auto-dosing setup similar to Bill's.

I've taken a year to plan this out, so when I say "near future" that means, hopefully, before December 31. I'm patient and planning to build everything perfectly. I'm heavily leaning on the learning and experience of others.
 
#5 ·
I've been a busy boy.

I've ordered all the parts for my Wasser-controller, they should be here in the next few days. Included in that is the float valve I'll be using for my auto top off as well as the irrigation solenoids.

I also removed the overflow and painted the back of the tank. I'll put some pics up later.

I was planning to draw out a P&ID of the plumbing today so that I could get an idea of what all parts I'll need, but I've had a slight hang-up with my 60-P that requires my immediate attention, so the P&ID will have to wait.
 
#8 ·
As mentioned, I cut out the overflow.

Before:



After:



I left the bottom silicone in place since it'll be covered by substrate and this way if I ever decide to put it back on, I've got an outline(as if it wouldn't already be easy enough).

And I painted the back of the tank black.

Before:



Midway (placing styrofoam under the tank):



After:

 
#10 ·
I was born and raised in the Greater Atlanta Area...Lawrenceville out in Gwinnett County...and I do miss it sometimes. Not the traffic though...(sorry for the off topic comment in your journal)

I'm looking forward to watching this one develop and seeing what I can learn along the way. Great stuff!
 
#12 ·
I got all the parts in for my controller and I got it all soldered together:



I have four independently controller sockets in the Technical-Pro power supply, with 2 spares for non controlled power. I have 2 24 VAC controlled ports on the controller for my water change solenoids when I pipe everything together.

I'll be operating co2/light bank 1 together and UV/light bank 2 together to start off with so I'll have s splitter downstream of the socket. I've wired the power supply so that the relays are in parrellel to the switches, and therefore the switches on the PS can manually turn on a circuit. Depending on my uses later, I may rewire this so that the switches manually override the relays and shut down the circuits.

Materials include:

* DIG 5006 Drip Irrigation Controller ordered from Sprinkler Warehouse for $65.
* 4 120 VAC, 3 Amp relays, part number Tyco KHAU-1711-24 ordered from ebay,
$4/each
* Technical Pro PS-S8 rack mount power supply ordered form ebay, $20/shipped
* 2 Rainbird irrigation solenoids, 1" NPT, from Sprinkler Warehouse, $11
* 1 "miniature" float switch from Fish Bowl Innovations, $12 plus shipping
* Some granulated activated carbon inline cannisters for the refill line


I'll be taking a little break from this tank for the next month or so. I'm taking some distance learning classes and have to focus my efforts on finishing those up during January.
 
#13 ·
i have a 75 gallon should i have put styrofoam under my tank? doesnt this help with not cracking???? my tank is a oceanic soo the glass is pretty thick. but can you still have problems with a crack? your tank is gonna look nice. i love the 120 gallon just dont have the space for it.i cant wait to see this all planted up :)
 
#14 ·
Well, I've had a 75g without any foam under it. Unless it's a custom tank, most manufactures use the same thickness in their glass according to tank size. As tanks get larger, the slightest contortion of the glass can result in a shattered tank and a flooded house. 75 is kind of borderline to me. Any larger and I would personally always put foam under it. Any smaller and I never worry about it. It's a personal judgment call.

I leveled the stand, and subsequently the tank, but the foam underneath it will help out that much more for any inconsistencies in the floor or stand once I put water in it.
 
#17 ·
Well, time to get moving on this thing. Local club auction is March 7, so I'd LOVE to have it cycled by then.

I'm putting the finishing touches on the plumbing design right at the moment, and I need a sanity check.



Look at my drawing. Will I get flow through both strainers? The part of me that has engineering experience can't reconcile the part of me that's like everybody else.

On the one hand, path of less resistance and all that, it seems like I'd get more flow through Strainer A. But ther other part of me says that, assuming that the tube is filled with water, I'll get flow from both equally(or at least approximately equally).

Sanity check please.
 

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#18 ·
Ok, here we go.

Here's my first pass at a plumbing design.....ok, not my first pass, but my first "final draft". Image first"



To fill in some holes:
  1. T M means Top Macros, B m means Bottom Micros, T R is Top Refill, B CO2 is, well, you get the idea
  2. Spray bar is substrate level, and points up and slightly towards back glass

Now, to head off what I think will be a few questions/immediate thoughts:
  1. Tank is corner drilled. Intake/output must enter the tank in that corner
  2. Almost every ball valve is actually a ball valve/true union connection, except the pH probe
  3. Eheims don't have ball valves because they have their own disconnects
  4. Mag Drive 7, 700gph, is there for added circulation/co2 diffusion. Probably overkill at 700 gph, but I already have it, so no added expense. *Might* downgrade it to a Danner 5 @ 500 gph if necessary. Additionally, it runs the tank drain. Because of the design of my house, I need to pump the water up 7'. @ 7' of head, Danner 7 still gets 350 gph.
  5. The 700 gph is almost definitely an issue for the UV. I'm going to measure acutal flow, and if it is indeed an issue(as I beileve it will be) that will force the downgrade to the Danner 5

I really welcome all thoughts/suggestions because I'll be building soon.



Edit: Somebody suggested a drawing with flow direction, so, I've attached it below
 

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#20 ·
Hey Jeff,

I may have missed this but what size is your UV? With the plumbing scheme you have, you will have to match the flow to the UV as you suggested. Have you considered putting the two canisters on separate loops? You are pulling water for three pumps in the existing diagram - this will need a pretty big pipe to handle the flow and prevent cavitation. What diameter pipe are you going to use? If you just had the two canisters they would share an intake but one could return to your spray bar and the other to the top of the tank. If you plumbed the UV into one of those lines I would gues the flow would be appropriate for killing algae & bugs. For flow, you could add a power head internal to the tank and save some $$ on electricity. When your plants grow in they can hide the power head pretty well. I am sensitive to the electric cost as Califonia has a sliding rate scale ( $0.28/kWhr). With three pumps at 140 watts each, our bill jumped 60% over last year!

I would also suggest moving the ferts to a post pump position so you don't feed the filter sludge before the plants. You will have happy bacteria but could cause slime to build up quickly in your filter.

Looks like fun though, I think I need to another project!

Bill
 
#24 ·
Bill, you got me thinking about energy cost in general, so I did a little work up:



That's my estimated energy cost for my 120g. I didn't include my DIY controller, pH controller, and co2 solenoid because they are comparatively insignificant energy consumers.

The MD 7 will cost me about $35/year to operate. If I downgraded to a MD 5, it would only save me $13/year, so that ultimately doesn't seem worth it to me.

However, it gave me the idea of setting up the MD7 so that it was only on when the co2 solenoid is open. Best estimate is total 3 hours a day in that situation, bringing operating cost of the MD7 down to just $4/year.

The downside I foresee is wearing out the pump by the many cycles on and off per day. A lot to consider.



Edit: After analysing a little more, what might be the most intersting thing is that the MD 7 would be the largest power consumer, if left on all day.
 
#21 ·
Bill, that's a very good comment about the pump. Ultimately, it does seem wasteful to add in that MD 700. Max flow rate for my UV is like 560(or around there), so if indeed the MD 700 is able to pump over 560, then my UV is hindered, or pointless. And, the energy concern is valid.

However, I *need* the MD 700 to drain the tank. I have to go up 7'10" to get to a drain, and the Eheim's won't do that.

Your comment makes me consider redesigning and putting solenoid A and the MD 700 inline together, and hooking them up to the controller together, so that MD 700 turns on when Solenoid A opens so it can drain the tank.

Serious consideration (and the full consequences of) will have to wait until tomorrow


By design, there will be no powerheads in the tank. I'm with you, normally, on plant growth covering up wires, but I'm not planning on this being that dense of a tank, so they won't be covered up. The decision to include an over the back loc-line was a big one. I also had to make a tremdeous sacrifice for my water change system, which will use an in tank micro float switch. It will be minimally invasive, but even that was a severe concession. The alternatives to the float switch were relatively cost prohibitive.
 
#26 ·
Energy is cheap where you live... over here it's 12c in the first tier, and goes up to 24c after that.

Don't know about the plumbing... I tend to keep things as simple as possible, and when you connect that many things, they might start to work against each other. But I am not that knowledgeable with that sort of things.

Your controller setup looks good. Over here, the DIG controller is still sold for $33 at the HD. Keep in mind one limitation of the WC :D -- you can only have two things "on" at the same time.

I found that with light and pumps adding some heat to the water I don't need heaters at all... Might be different for a Discus tank though.
 
#28 ·
Energy is cheap where you live... over here it's 12c in the first tier, and goes up to 24c after that.
Absolutely. We moved from Alameda, CA. We didn't have air conditioning there and lived in a 950 sqft 2bd/1bath apartment. Now we have central air, 2400 sqft, and our electric bill is less(only by a few bucks).

Don't know about the plumbing... I tend to keep things as simple as possible, and when you connect that many things, they might start to work against each other. But I am not that knowledgeable with that sort of things.
I left a job with big oil to move to Atlanta, so I kind of miss the plumbing and wanted to have some fun with it.

Your controller setup looks good. Over here, the DIG controller is still sold for $33 at the HD. Keep in mind one limitation of the WC :D -- you can only have two things "on" at the same time.
Yeah, absolute bummer on the DIG Controller. I tried to get one through HD's website, but they don't have it(or at least didn't) on the website. I should have had a buddy buy one for me and mail it, would've saved me $30.

So far, I only need to have 2 relays on at one time, but that includes a light/co2 piggy back. I may have to pull the co2 off and put it on an outlet timer(I see that you ended up having to do that too).


I found that with light and pumps adding some heat to the water I don't need heaters at all... Might be different for a Discus tank though.
In the summer that will probably be the case for me, but right now, being winter, our basement drops down around 60. It's only a semi-finished basement. Before the end of the year I'm giving it its own HVAC zone, but I'll still probably keep it in the mid 60s.
 
#30 ·
Yeah, absolute bummer on the DIG Controller. I tried to get one through HD's website, but they don't have it(or at least didn't) on the website. I should have had a buddy buy one for me and mail it, would've saved me $30.
Yeah, you should have. :wink:

So far, I only need to have 2 relays on at one time, but that includes a light/co2 piggy back. I may have to pull the co2 off and put it on an outlet timer(I see that you ended up having to do that too).
Exactly... If you have more than one bank of lights, and need (or want) to run CO2 independently from that, that's when you run into that problem.
 
#29 ·
This is my current plumbing sketch. Basically, I moved ferts, H20 refill, and co2 downstream of the filter intakes. I then moved the UV over to the filter return line.

The max flowrate for the UV is 450 gph, and the flowrate of the eheims is stated at 270 gph each, 2x270 = 540....but with the filters full of media, and then all this plumbing, I'm gonna say the flow rate through the UV will be less than 450 gph.

This is what I'm going to go with, but if when it's all put together, the MD 7 is just WAY to much flow, I'll probably try to trade it out for an MD 5(45w instead of 70w for a savings of $13/year;) )
 

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#31 ·
Did i miss how the new water enters the system or are you still working on that?

Also a slight delay between opening the NC Solenoid and the closing the NO Solenoid might be a good idea so as not to make to much back pressure if the one closes faster then the other opens or something.
 
#32 ·
I got a little lazy on the drawing.

There's a manifold before the MD 7(in the latest diagram). There are 4 lines coming into it. 1 co2, 2 ferts, and the 4th is refill water. Here's where I got lazy, the drawing doesn't include the refill solenoid.

The solenoids that are on the drawing are wired together, so that N.O. is open when water goes into the tank, and N.C. is closed. Then, for water change, they switch. They'll pump for approximately 3 minutes, and then close. There is a mini-float switch in the tank, that is will be looped with the refill solenoid and controller. A minute or so after the drain solenoids are done, the controller will turn on power to the refill solenoid, and leave power on for 5 minutes(or whatever I determine is the amount of time to refill and top off), but the solenoid valve will be shut off by the float switch when the tank is full. Then, a minute or so later, power will be shut off to the solenoid/float switch loop until the next time it's scheduled to run.

If you are familiar with systems like this, that made sense to you. If not, just hang out and I'll get a diagram with control up here in a couple days.
 
#33 ·
Hey Jeffrey - I like the new lay out. Looks good.

One thing you could now consider is to replace the Mag 7 with a Needlewheel to mist your CO2. I believe your new plan has the CO2 by pass the filters and I didn't see a reactor. I have a similar situation with my 60 gallon and it works well.

Bill
 
#35 ·
looking pretty sweet. So i've been doing some looking into UV sterilizers, seams the max rated flow on them isn't always the most effective flow, wouldn't a 15 watt UV's be better suited for the flow on one Eheim 2028? If you plumbed it before the N.C. Ball Valve and drain i would think it would work better. I've also have read that you only need 1 to 1.5 turn over on a UV to get rid of algea and what not.
 
#36 ·
looking pretty sweet. So i've been doing some looking into UV sterilizers, seams the max rated flow on them isn't always the most effective flow, wouldn't a 15 watt UV's be better suited for the flow on one Eheim 2028? If you plumbed it before the N.C. Ball Valve and drain i would think it would work better.
Probably, and if the UV isn't working how it should, I'll move it.


I've also have read that you only need 1 to 1.5 turn over on a UV to get rid of algae and what not.
The UV won't be running 24/7. I'll probably only have it on for 2 hours a day.
 
#41 · (Edited)
That is definitely something to research. I feel like the general consensus has been that it's better to turn it off than leave it on all the time, again to preserve bulb life.

But, I know that light bulbs, as with pretty much all electrical devices, do take a hit like you said when cycled on and off. UV bulbs are freakin' expensive, so I definitely want to prolong bulb life.

I wonder which is worse.

Anybody have any thoughts?



Also something to consider is that if you want the UV to kill Parasites to need about 1/3 of the flow that it takes to kill Bacteria and Algae.

That is a good point. Moving the UV over to a single 2028 may be the way I go after all.
 
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