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-   -   Something is missing from my fertilizer! (http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=196243)

Smertrios 11-05-2012 01:03 PM

Something is missing from my fertilizer!
 
From www.aquariumfertilizer.com I bought

monopotassium phosphate
potassium nitrate
plantex csm + b
barrs general hardness booster

I have anacharis, duckweed and javamoss in a tank. At first the anacharis was growing well and shooting down some roots and growing fast then the leaves would start growing a lighter green color and old parts of the plant would yellow and "melt". Now all I get are thin leaves and slow if any growth. The moss seems stunted I dont notice any new growth from it and the duckweed is growing *but* very slow for duckweed.

Its a 10 gallon tank and every week this is the routine (measurments are all tsp's)

day1:
50% water change
1/8 potassium nitrate
1/32 monopotassium phosphate
1/32 plantex csm+b
1/4 barrs general hardness booster

day3:
1/8 potassium nitrate
1/32 monopotassium phosphate
1/32 plantex csm+b

day 5:
1/8 potassium nitrate
1/32 monopotassium phosphate
1/32 plantex csm+b

I thought that by using this I would have no problems. OH! the tank is CO2 enriched and the plants pearled. As the plants got older and the growth started stopping as described above they stopped pearling.

EDIT: Its been several weeks now...

houseofcards 11-05-2012 01:17 PM

I don't know everything about your setup, but how come your not dosing Potassium Sulfate (SO4)

Smertrios 11-05-2012 01:26 PM

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=21944
The fertilizers faq is what I am going by.

acitydweller 11-05-2012 01:39 PM

macros and micros should not be dosed on the same days due to precipitation between iron and phosphate. they should be staggered across the week which is why they recommend macros x3 and micros x3 weekly then WC on the 7th day.

shift the plantex csm+b dosing on alternate days.

houseofcards 11-05-2012 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smertrios (Post 2068084)
From www.aquariumfertilizer.com
...leaves would start growing a lighter green color and old parts of the plant would yellow and "melt". Now all I get are thin leaves and slow if any growth. ...

This sounds like a K (Potassium) deficiency. It's always a good idea to dose extra K in a c02/good light tank.

Kathyy 11-05-2012 02:01 PM

There is supposed to be plenty of potassium from the other two macros if they are dosed. I dose potassium if I decide to use less of one of the others though.

Agree about alternating macros and micros, it is remotely possible the iron and phosphate are precipitating out and doing the plants no good.
This is the suggestion there -
Day 1
50% water change
barrs general hardness booster
Days 2, 4, 6
potassium nitrate
monopotassium phosphate
Days 3, 5, 7
plantex csm+b

How much light and what is the lighting period? How is the tank stocked?

Perhaps there isn't enough nitrate and phosphate for the stocking level.

I have had plants perk up after dosing additional magnesium via Epsom salts.

HD Blazingwolf 11-05-2012 02:06 PM

ferric phosphate which is formed when iron and phosphorus meet is usable by plants, its actually in a lot of terrestrial fertilizers. HOWEVER, it requires a lot of enery for the plants to use it, and it takes a long time for it to degrade enough for the roots to pick it up.

that being said i would alternate my dosing days to prevent this, what kind of light ? co2 if anyt do u have?

houseofcards 11-05-2012 02:08 PM

Regardless he's showing a deficiency. Dosing extra K will only help so it's a no-brainer to put it in. K get's used up very quickly in co2/good light. Personally I would do that than go by the notion that there is 'suppose' to be enough from the other two macros.

BruceF 11-05-2012 02:23 PM

check the calcium... anacahris likes calcium.

dr.tran 11-05-2012 03:06 PM

I agree with many of the post above. Dosing macros and micros on the same day never affected me. As long as I give it about 15 minutes in between dosing. They have to be thoroughly dissolve before adding the micro or macro. I forget the science but plantbrain has explained it in the past.

It seems like you scaled down the EI ferts to a 10 gal tank. So you shouldn't have a problem with potassium especially with something like anacharis. However, for me it seems to do better in hard water. What is your kH and gH? You may need to double up on the GH booster depending on your source water. There is calcium and magnesium in the GH booster. You just might not be adding enough of it.

Also how are you Co2 injecting and what is your light/photoperiod? What is your substrate? Generally I find that anacharis is a low light plant so I doubt that's the problem unless its the extremes. Which then leads me to my next point, how heavily planted is the tank? If its very heavy or you have lots of light, you have to balance it out by adding more Co2. Or even at another extreme, may have to boost your ferts to supplement the extra plant load.

But most likely I think you have to double up on your GH booster.

dr.tran 11-05-2012 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by houseofcards (Post 2068131)
Regardless he's showing a deficiency. Dosing extra K will only help so it's a no-brainer to put it in. K get's used up very quickly in co2/good light. Personally I would do that than go by the notion that there is 'suppose' to be enough from the other two macros.

Your approach is definitely understandable. For some time I also thought I was also missing potassium and started to dose K2SO4 to make up for my deficency.

But with the EI dosing I worked out by molecular mass that it would be a ratio of 1: .08 : .15 of NPK. Which should be sufficient. The numbers might be off a little. I have to find my notes but my point is that the potassium is not at at a level that's below the minimum threshold.

Also I never noticed any difference when adding or not adding K2SO4 as long as I use the EI routine

Hoppy 11-05-2012 03:38 PM

As I recall, "Barrs GH Booster" contains a lot of potassium sulfate, so I doubt this being a potassium deficiency. We need to start at the beginning - the lighting. What specific light fixture are you using?

I vaguely recall that Anacharis is a cool water plant, which doesn't handle warm water very well. If that is correct, is your water warmer than it used to be?

houseofcards 11-05-2012 03:49 PM

Your just guessing. You don't know how much mass/uptake is going on. I don't have to be right to say it's better to put it in then not to. If he doesn't put it in, he might be short if he does he's not, it's that simple.

Smertrios 11-05-2012 03:52 PM

Thanks for all the replies and so fast! I was putting the micros and macros in a bottle than adding water before shaking. I'll start dosing macros and micros on alternate days and see if that helps. And if not I will try other things (might do that anyway after I see if changing dosing helps)

For CO2 I have a 20lb cylinder and a home made reactor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LB3ETWh5JCA

For lighting I am using 2 14 watt 6000k CFLs

houseofcards 11-05-2012 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dr.tran (Post 2068187)
Your approach is definitely understandable. For some time I also thought I was also missing potassium and started to dose K2SO4 to make up for my deficency.

But with the EI dosing I worked out by molecular mass that it would be a ratio of 1: .08 : .15 of NPK. Which should be sufficient. The numbers might be off a little. I have to find my notes but my point is that the potassium is not at at a level that's below the minimum threshold.

Also I never noticed any difference when adding or not adding K2SO4 as long as I use the EI routine

The beauty of EI to me is that you don't really have to test that much (or at all). Wondering about ratios, etc. etc is great if you like to treat your tank like a test tube, but in reality every tank is different and you simply don't know that. If you dose high-end EI and are religious about water changes, etc you will eliminate 95% of any issue that develop. If I had to worry about testing every parameter I would have quit this hobby a long time ago.


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