question about a S. American biotype setup

[abica]

Hello all

Ive been trying to decide what to do with my 29 gal and the stand I built for it, and Ive decided to go with a south american biotype featuring angelfish and other critters and plants from a semi-specific area.

So far Ive figured I would go with a blackwater tank, 2 angels, a school of hatchetfish, some corys or other little cats, and probably some sort of pleco, or any kind of sucker cat from the area. Plants- swords, val., chain swords, and cabomba, maybe some others that would fit the system. Im figuring on using a power filter with appropriate flow and 60-70 watts of PC light. Really dont want to use CO2.

So, my water is fairly hard, maybe 7dkh and 16 dgh and ph 8.0. The angel supplier I plan to go with raises their angels in water thats closer to mine than the natural habitat, so Im thinking they would do good in my water. But I was also considering peat in the filter to drop my hardness and ph. Scary though, every other tank Ive done has been 'good without tampering.' So Im kind of leery about doing something like peat, dont know how well I will be able to regulate and stabilize the chemistry. Would really hate to see a ph drop kill my expensive pretty fish and bugger up the setup.

Fish question: what about those little S.A. cichlids? would one or two of a peaceful species fit in well with the setup, or am I pushing my luck?

OK plant questions: assuming I dont need to tamper with my ph for the fish, will my ph and hardness have a negative impact on my plants? and also does anyone think this setup would need anything modified to do it right? I dont need a perfect world-class setup with show quality plants, just a healthy tank with healthy plants.

Any feedback? Changes? Additional species I should consider, or other water additive/filtration options?

[Saluki]

I have been working on creating exactly what you are planning for the last several months. My starting water parameters are nearly the same as yours (pH 7.8, KH 5), tank size is the same (29 gallons), and biotope is the same (SA blackwater stream). I have the following suggestions:

1. You will be disappointed with your plants if you do not do some form of CO2 injection. I have tried for several years to grow plants in my water, which has a little more natural CO2 than yours, and they just do not do well, even with good lighting (60 watts), good substrate (laterite, a little top soil, and sand), and regular fertilizer. When I added CO2 injection, it was like a miracle. For my water, I needed 2 DIY CO2 injectors (2 liter soda bottles with a water/sugar/yeast/baking soda mix) to get my CO2 up into the 15 ppm range, which is ideal for plant growth. When I got there, the plants took off. For your water, dropping the pH down to about 7.1 with CO2 injection would put you into the ideal CO2 range.

Also, even if the fish you select were bred in water similar to yours, they will be much happier in water closer to their native parameters. A few decades of captive breeding does not erase millions of years of adaptation.

2. I strongly recommend against angelfish in a 29 gal tank. They are simply too big to be comfortable. I would save them for a 55 gal or larger. For the same reason, I would avoid discus as well. Dwarf SA cichlids are ideal for this biotope. I chose a pair of German Blue Rams, but any of the Rams or Apistograma species would work well. Be careful with some of the Apistogrammas because they can be a little agressive. If you select an agressive species, you will need to be more careful about selecting hardy fish to go with it.

3. For the mid-strata schoolers, I chose a couple of schools of small tetras, specifically black neons and glowlights. These species look extraordinary in the blackwater environment.

4. For the upper strata, I chose marble hatchets. The silver hatchets are more readily available, but the marbles are much more interesting looking.

5. For bottom feeders, I currently have a few ottocinclus. They do an impressive job of algae control for their modest size. Most of the other loricariids simply get too big for a 29 gal tank. I may add a few corry cats down the road, but the jury is still out.

6. If you plan to use a sand substrate, I strongly recommend a small cannister filter rather than a power filter. I went through 2 power filters (the sand gets into the impeller well, and causes havoc) before I finally poneyed up for a cannister (an Eheim 2233). It has made a world of difference. Not only does it offer better filtration, since a cannister filters the water before it goes into the impeller well, the sand does not destroy it. Best of all, it is absolutely silent.

[abica]

So it is reasonable to assume I could get stable chemistry if I use CO2 injection?

And finally, what do you use to get your water...black? An additive, peat, or something else?

Sand...well my 10 and the 29 setup I had a few years back were both sand bottom, and as much as I like it I think Ill try gravel since its something different and its been a pain to run planted tanks with sand...crud shows up too easily, cant make it into the substrate, not enough weight, etc etc. And i fouled up a filter with sand one time, now I am careful not to stir it up near the intake heh

So 2 angels wouldnt be happy in a 29 once they are full grown eh? Bummer, but I guess the other cichlids from the area will do nicely. Plenty of time for different species...many years left

Thanks for a quick reply, not setting up for a bit yet but my stand is done, the 29 is back from a friend who had jewels in it, and Im gonna make my girlfriend clean it soon hehe...then Ill set up, put the substrate in and just let things happen when they happen, hopefully Ill get the fish before winter, since Ill probably mail-order. Unless there is a really great LFS in springfield, even St Louis' best one (beldts) doesnt have marbled hatchets, which is what Im wanting too after seeing pictures of them. Then I would have to come up and buy some critters, gas not more expensive than shipping costs. Also I really like the idea of using otos...cool looking and everyone doesnt instantly see it and say "ohh cool a suckerfish!" Nothing against plecos, just see too many and they get big.

[Saluki]

I find it very esasy to maintain a stable pH. With a 2 bottle system, I start one, then start the other one a week later, then change one out each week thereafter. My pH comes in right at 7.0 (before the addition of blackwater chemicals.

Right now, for the blackwater effect, I use Kent Blackwater expert. At the recommended dosage, it drops the pH another 0.2 units to 6.8, which is perfect for the fish. I may switch to peat down the road if I decide the additive is too expensive, but I am happy with it for now.

As for the marble hatchets, I am still looking for them myself. The Fish Man, which is our better store, has been trying to order them for several weeks, but the suppliers are out. Other stores in town have the silver hatchets, but I really dont want them. I have seen them on www.liveaquaria.com , but was reluctant to pay the shipping for cheapo fish. If the Fish Man doesnt get them in soon, I may break down and order them. If I do, maybe we could combine an order to save on shipping, and meet somewhere half way (Litchfield would be a good spot) to transfer the fish. I would probably order a few other things while I was at it just to make it worthwhile.