Fish in quarantine with random dropsy

[sewingalot]

Three rounds of maracyn 2, the last with melafix and pimafix combo and these are the results:

Here is the female:


Here is the female with the other fish that have symptoms showing now. Notice the sunken belly and big eyes - this is the beginning stages, before the dropsy hits. I hate this wasting away.


I put them in bigger tank, and I am currently not treating them. I threw in half a dozen almond leaves and the water is a nice tea color. I also put in 1 tsp of espom salts until I can get more information on this disease. I am worried about over medicating at this point and want to give them a rest.

[lauraleellbp]

Wow, she still doesn't look good.

You know, the almond leaves gave me an idea; Jack Wattley commonly treats discus just by dropping the pH down to the 5.0 range. The fish are much more able to handle the transition than many parasites and bacteria, so he's able to kill of many problems without any use of medications at all.

You've tried meds now with only minimal impact, maybe this is worth a try since you've still got other fish going downhill?

[sewingalot]

She's eating fine and swimming around with the other sickly fish, but they aren't any better. The almond leaves are my latest trial. If Jack Wattley has done it successfully with his discus, I am hopeful. Let's see what happens. Also, I forgot to mention 3 of the five fish left now have dropsy. The other two are just wasted.

[Karackle]

Aw Sara, I'm so sorry! I know how awful it can be to feel helpless when treating fish, I've definitely been there!

I'm rooting for the almond leaves and lowered pH! Good luck!!!

[brohawk]

Any updates w/ the almond leaves Sara? I thought I'd beaten the same infection in my tank as I'd had no issues the last 3 months, but today I notice a dull, quickly breathing M. Kubotai (was always the warning sign I've seen before this particular cause of dropsy) and both a sunken bellied CPD and a Boraras Micro.

[sewingalot]

Funny you should ask. I just took some pictures for reference.





The sunken fish are showing curvy spines, but the female does appear to be feeling better. I think the almond leaves are helping with the swelling, but it isn't curing them. Is it possible this is fish tuberculosis? From day one, they have had the sunken appearance and curvy spine.

[lauraleellbp]

You know, Sara, as soon as you pointed out the curvy spine, Fish TB is what popped in my head. It would explain all the symptoms so far, too.

[brohawk]

Actually, I've always wondered why no one in this thread had suggested it yet, as all the info I'd found before seemed to be pointing towards TB. But, I've never read anything about dropsy as another symptom of TB, and both yours and mine seem to be fish-specific. Each fish that catches it either shrinks, or bloats, but never one symptom before the other.

[sewingalot]

Which saddens me as it looks like it isn't curable and they have linked it to neglect in many cases. That means some jerk is out there, selling sick fish that don't have to be. Especially such a rare fish!

Edit: Ninja'd by brohawk! Replying to you now.

[sewingalot]

Originally Posted by brohawk

Actually, I've always wondered why no one in this thread had suggested it yet, as all the info I'd found before seemed to be pointing towards TB. But, I've never read anything about dropsy as another symptom of TB, and both yours and mine seem to be fish-specific. Each fish that catches it either shrinks, or bloats, but never one symptom before the other.

Exactly! That is what is so difficult about this disease. Nothing and then bam - sunken bellies or bloating. Then after lingering, death. I have tried cutting back on feeding, adding more nutrient enriched foods, changing the water twice a week, medicine after medicine and nothing. I really just would like to know what this is.

[mistergreen]

yeah, wear those gloves when handling them. We all had a feeling it was an infection and not due to poor water quality. I might go the euthanasia route. I don't think they can recover. Don't forget to sterilize the tank afterwards.

I saw CPD for the first time in person. Holy cow, they're small; like Boraras size.

[sewingalot]

After reading more and more, I am thinking euthanasia is the best way to go. I would like to be sure before giving up on them, but it sounds like you'll never know unless you get an autopsy.

Side note: I've never seen a boraras in person, so I'll take your word for it.

[brohawk]

I've done all the same as you Sara, w/ the same results... I wonder too if there's something w/ the CPDs that make them more susceptible though? I had equal parts M. Kubotai, CPD and B. Micro in my tank, of which 80% of the Kubotai developed dropsy and none wasted away (they were the newest arrivals to the tank and I had only quarantined them for 2 weeks, so no guarantee it was the same infection), whereas maybe only 40 or 50% of the CPDs got sick. Of those, only the females developed dropsy while only the males wasted away (8 or 9 fish total w/ no exceptions). This is the first time I've seen one of the Boraras wasting away, and they've been in the tank the longest.

[lauraleellbp]

Like human TB, fish TB is a really contagious disease. And there's really only very few big fish importers in the US, especially importing from any given area of the world, so many, many fish could potentially have been exposed.

Sara, I think putting them down is probably your best option at this point. And unfortunately, the even worse news is that even fish not visibly displaying symptoms may still be carriers- so I think you'd be wisest to euthanize the whole QT tank.

It's only the new fish that were still in QT that have displayed any symptoms, right? And you were careful to wash your hands and not use the same net from tank to tank [hoping]?

[Karackle]

I'm so sorry to say this, but in my experience, curvy spines and "pineconing" (bloating/dropsy) are definitely signs of fish TB, it kills me to say this, but I've got to agree with Laura Lee, your best bet might be to euthanize the whole QT tank If there are fish that are not showing signs of illness, I suppose you COULD maintain them in that tank and keep all of your equipment separated if you can't bare to euthanize fish that appear to be carriers only.

Also, be careful if you have any open cuts on your hands, fish TB can manifest as a nasty rash in people (but don't worry, it definitely won't give you human TB).