Fish in quarantine with random dropsy

[lauraleellbp]

Garlic can help with internal parasites, but not a bacterial or viral infection. Based on how quickly her fish went down, I expect the issue was one of these. If it had been most parasites, the deaths would have been much more spaced out over time.

[Karackle]

Originally Posted by Church

^ +1 on the garlic. Nature's everything-cure! We feed garlic pills hidden inside of Greenies pill pockets to our cats, for worm and flea control, and to help their skin/coats. It totally works, and we don't have to buy expensive pharmaceutical products for them.

Also, it keeps the vampires away.

for fleas too and it really works? wow. awesome.

Originally Posted by lauraleellbp

Garlic can help with internal parasites, but not a bacterial or viral infection. Based on how quickly her fish went down, I expect the issue was one of these. If it had been most parasites, the deaths would have been much more spaced out over time.

That's a good point, unless they all came with parasites and are now dropping off? maybe not that quickly after seeing symptoms though...

[Church]

Originally Posted by Karackle

for fleas too and it really works? wow. awesome.

As far as we can tell. Our cats aren't allowed outside, so I'm sure that helps some too. Also, there's another "homeopathic" routine we apply, which probably helps out too... about once every 2 weeks we spray the cats' coats down with a 50/50 mixture of cider vinegar and water. It used to be very difficult to do this, lol, but with a little trial and error we've figured out how to minimize, if not eliminate, the scratches to our hands and arms.

[lauraleellbp]

Originally Posted by Church

about once every 2 weeks we spray the cats' coats down with a 50/50 mixture of cider vinegar and water. It used to be very difficult to do this, lol, but with a little trial and error we've figured out how to minimize, if not eliminate, the scratches to our hands and arms.

ROFL I just got a visual...

Ever read that old joke, "how to feed a cat a pill"? http://www.jokefile.co.uk/numerical_order/1132.html

[Church]

LMAO!!! That literally had me cracking up! I've never heard that one before. It's so freaking true, too! I bookmarked that one so I can show my girlfriend when she gets home.

Wow, that was funny!

Seriously, though, I gotta recommend these pill pocket things:



They *really* work. At least for us they do. Well, one of our cats just eats the garlic/yeast pills like they are treats in their own right... but our other cat is too damn smart, so we have to use the pill pockets. In fact, even with the pill pocket wrapped around them, if we weren't 100% perfect in wrapping it around the pill so that there's it's evenly coating the entire surface area, she eats the pill pocket right off of the pill, leaving the pill behind.

To Sara: Sorry for going off-topic. Didn't mean to thread-jack.

[lauraleellbp]

Yeah, those work great for our dogs. The cats just bite them in half and spit out pills, though...

[Karackle]

I just wrap pills in a bit of cheese for the dogs works like a charm every time for one of my dogs (he doesn't believe in chewing tasty cheese ) but my other dog is more of a chewer / taster so I have to make sure the pill is REALLY well wrapped

Sorry Sara.....we got a little off topic here

[sewingalot]

The jungle clear didn't work, obviously:



It did at first, and then as soon as I started feeding her: POOF!

I was about to euthanize this fish, but I finally was able to locate some Maracyn II and started her on this. The question of morals come in, though. At what pint to you stope treating the fish and end its suffering?

I AM feeding BBS on occasion. I haven't for a few weeks, though. I mostly feed spirulina algae flakes (or however you spell it). Could this be this issue???

Don't worry about going off topic, guys. I am quite known for my tangents. On that subject, I wrap my cat in a towel and push pills down at the side. Works everytime.

[lauraleellbp]

Geez... poor fish!

You said she was looking better, but then swelled right back up after feeding? If that's true, then it suggests that the issue may very well be related to the digestive system, and rmc's suggestion may be right on. Since egg shells are the issue, were you feeding BBS you're hatching yourself, or feeding decapped eggs?

On the morals issue- I euthanize fish when I don't feel like I can do anything more to get them better and they look like they're in pain.

[sewingalot]

I normally feed BBS I hatch on my own or the flakes. This time it was flakes. I hate to keep the fish alive if she is suffering, but honestly other than the puffiness, she is still swimming around, and seems alert. It's just she looks so painful.

[mistergreen]

well, you're on the right track. When my fish gets dropsy, they usually die on their own within a day or 2.

[lauraleellbp]

Well, since spirulina is algae and green, it should have the opposite effect that BBS egg shells would... I think BBS shells can block/constipate, and possibly even make tears in the digestive system from sharp edges. Tears would be the worst case scenario, but could explain what's going on...

I've no idea what the active ingredient in Jungle Clear is?

I'm a bit perplexed at the underlying cause, but Maracyn can't hurt, as it will make sure there's no infection going - whether it's primary or secondary to a different issue is what I'm not at all sure of.

How much a chance do you think there is that they may have ingested BBS egg shells?

[Karackle]

Poor fish! I do agree it seems to be a digestive issue if she got worse again after feeding as for a cure though, unfortunately i have nothing new to suggest. As for the euthanize vs treat issue, if she's swimming around and seems happy other than being puffy, I'd keep treating, if she takes a turn for the worse and is having trouble swimming or sitting on the bottom, that's when I usually decide it's time to euthanize.

As for the BBS issue, when you hatch them, do you take measures to remove the shells before feeding them to the fish? (strain them or let them settle etc.) If so, I'd venture that that isn't the issue, when I worked in zebrafish research lab, we fed freshly hatched BBS twice a day, every day and in 3 years I think I saw 1 case of dropsy in thousands of fish, and we would start feeding BBS to the babies we raised when they were quite a bit smaller than the size of a full grown CPD without issue. That said, it's likely the babies were only picking at the swimming BBS and an adult ZFish is quite a bit bigger than an adult CPD. If, however, you are feeding the whole mix with shells, perhaps they are eating many more than the fish in my lab, and i reckon it could cause problems. I know that they don't digest them (you can see undigested shells in the fish poop under a microscope......yes, I'm a bio nerd )

[mistergreen]

Originally Posted by lauraleellbp

.

I've no idea what the active ingredient in Jungle Clear is?

I believe it contains dewormers, insecticides to kill off internal and external parasites.

[plantbrain]

I think antibiotics will clear up the dropsy issue, there's some neglect going on in your routine. Overfeeding, not doing larger water changes, etc.

Dropsy is virtually always an aquarist issue. Neglect.
Maracyn TWO will clear it up if the fish are not too far gone already.

As far as general homeopathic stuff, I think two products: pimafix and melafix are pretty good.

Peat is also, so are plants and even driftwood that leaches tannins.
Good clean water etc, clean filters, well tended aquariums.

Good food, UV sterilizers, Q ing fish and live food other than brine........before adding them etc.........

Regards,
Tom Barr