pH Calibration Solution

[ColeMan]

I do have a drop checker, and use it as a visual indicator to keep my CO2 in check as well as a reference point with which to dial in my CO2 levels when initially setting up the controller...

I agree that a drop checker is vital, as even the best pH probe will begin to give inaccurate readings after a while; plus it makes it super simple to fine-tune CO2 levels with little guesswork...

For me, the greatest thing about the AC Jr. is the multi-faceted timer controls, which I find extremely useful. Plus I think that, long term, it will help me keep my hands out of the tank!!
Thanks you both for your insight! Always appreciated...

[calihawker]

My aquacontroller is indespensible. I have it controlling water changes, fert dosing, lighting schemes, ph and temps. In all I have 12 devices being controlled

If you don't have the aquanotes software, get it. It's well worth it!


Steve

[ColeMan]

Yeah, I haven't really tried it out yet...is the free version good at all? I'd like to use it to make programming easier and enter custom presets for things like seasonal temperature variations, etc. Which version do you have/recommend?

[calihawker]

They have a free version? I have ver. 3.01. It might be outdated by now, i've been using it for a long time. I used the seasonal and moonlight features to get corals to spawn It was awesome!

[ColeMan]

the free version is 'Aquanotes Light'...It looks like they're shipping version 3.4 now...I guess I should see if I can do the programming i need with the free version...

[sonaps]

According to a technician I spoke with at Milwaukee a few years back you don’t need to use two solutions (even if your controller has two set points) unless you plan to test solutions in either the high or low range. For an aquarium you will get accurate readings using just the 7.01 solution.

I’m not sure what probe Kayakbabe is using, but according to the technician I spoke to most probes only last between 12 to 15 months. You can test your probe by putting it in Windex with ammonia and seeing how fast the reading goes up to 10, it should be very fast. It doesn’t matter where it stops just so long as the reading is above ten. You can tell that you may need to replace the probe if the reading goes to ten very slowly or if it doesn’t ever get there. He said it’s kind of like a light bulb, when the filament burns out its time to change it. He said the reason Windex with ammonia is good for testing is that it has a high reading with no buffer to “pull” the reading up, like is used in the calibration solutions.

[Left C]

Originally Posted by Naja002

Some controllers/meters have a 2 point calibration (Pinpoint) and some have only 1 (Milwaukee)--You need to find out what your's requires.

My understanding is that with 2 point calibration--it doesn't matter whether you use the 7 & 10, or 4 & 7. I went with 4 & 7, because we normally shoot for pH in the lower range. Just seemed to make a bit more sense to me.....

HTH

The Milwaukee controllers have the ability to be calibrated using two points. The slope adjustment screw is on the back of the unit right in the very center. You can see a very tiny hole there and inside it you can see a slot to put the screwdriver in.

There's a separate card that comes with the directions that says for use in freshwater, do not adjust the slope adjustment. Only use the 7.01 pH buffer solution.

I don't know why Milwaukee says that, but it works fine as far as I can tell. I've had two Milwaukee pH controllers for about 3 years now. I've only had one problem with them. I was in the hospital for 12 days, the CO2 cannister with one of the quariums ran out. When I came home I had a bad case of BBA everywhere in the aquarium. It was all over the probe too. I couldn't clean it. I just replaced the probe and it has worked fine ever since.

I have read of several people mentioning that they do the two point calibration on the Milwaukee units. I really don't know if it helped them or not.

With the advent of drop checkers using the known or lab certified 4 dKH solutions with my pH controllers; my life has become very easy.

At the college here, we always use two point calibration on our pH testers. We store the probes in a 4M KCl solution.

Edit: I see that sonaps mentioned that you only do a single point calibration.

[Naja002]

Yep, and from what I understand if ya call Milwaukee--they'll tell ya not to do the 2 point for freshwater. I don't know, because I haven't called them myself, but that's my understanding from past searches. So, for our purposes--its really just a single point calibration.....

[Left C]

Originally Posted by Naja002

Yep, and from what I understand if ya call Milwaukee--they'll tell ya not to do the 2 point for freshwater. I don't know, because I haven't called them myself, but that's my understanding from past searches. So, for our purposes--its really just a single point calibration.....

That's not really true, is it?

The Milwaukee unit certainly has the capability to allow a 2 point calibration even those it's rarely used. Some people do use it though.

Your comment is like saying your car doesn't have high beam lights because you don't use them when in fact it certainly has that capability.

Originally Posted by sonaps

According to a technician I spoke with at Milwaukee a few years back you don’t need to use two solutions (even if your controller has two set points) unless you plan to test solutions in either the high or low range. For an aquarium you will get accurate readings using just the 7.01 solution...

Naja002, what do you think of this comment?

Would you say that the Pinpoint pH controller is only capable of a single point calibration because that is what someone is doing even though the controller certainly has the capability to do a two point calibration?

If it was decided to use either of these controllers for a purpose that required that a 2 point calibration must be done for that purpose, would you still say that they are single point calibration controllers?

Last August on Rex's form you posted a thread called: "Looking for Feedback---C02 Equipment Page...." You were asking for people to review your web page and give feedback. I told you this:

Originally Posted by Left C

Hi Naja

I like your CO2 info, but I'd like to offer a correction. The Milwaukee controller offers dual point calibration, but they recommend that you use single point calibration with the 7.01 buffer solution for aquarium use. The slope adjustment is not needed.

Left C

Facts are facts. If it's there, it's there.

I really doesn't matter to me what you think about these controllers, but you shouldn't be giving bad information.

What would a person think that just bought one and read the instructions showing how to do a 2 point calibration and then they see your comments saying that it doesn't have that capability? Would they be confused? What would they think about your comments?

Are you using either of these pH controllers, anyway?

[Naja002]

Originally Posted by Left C

Are you using either of these pH controllers, anyway?

Sheesh. Yes, I have one of each with indentical Omega probes. PP recommends the 2 point calibration. Milwaukee 1 point calibration.

I don't know, because I haven't called them myself, but that's my understanding from past searches.

The online manual calls for 2 point. Call Milwaukee.`I stated my position in the quote above. Ever question why the PP calls for 2 point and both adjustments are on the front with easy access. Yet the Milwaukee has the slope through some itty-bitty freakin' hole on the back. Hello?

Call Milwaukee.

[Naja002]

Originally Posted by Left C

The Milwaukee controllers have the ability to be calibrated using two points.

Right, I got that. But you and I and plenty of others spend a bunch of time typing the same stuff over and over and over and over again. Why? To try to help the newest influx of newbies through all of their confusion. What you typed (quoted below) spells it out: 2nd point calibration isn't needed/recommended by the manufacturer for freshwater use. There's no need for me to explain that over and over and over again. You can if you want to, but most of my typing is free-hand, not copy and paste. It gets old after a while. Its there. I know its there. I don't use it, but I know its there. I don't need to tell the new guy, because it will just add to their confusion--and my typing.

Originally Posted by Left C

There's a separate card that comes with the directions that says for use in freshwater, do not adjust the slope adjustment. Only use the 7.01 pH buffer solution.

Even your own info supports what sonaps and I said. We know it there, but Milwaukee apparently says its not needed.....

Originally Posted by Left C

I don't know why Milwaukee says that, but it works fine as far as I can tell. I've had two Milwaukee pH controllers for about 3 years now. I've only had one problem with them.

I just assume that Milwaukee knows their products and realizes that for our application--its not need. I don't doubt for a second the adjusting the slope works fine, but according to Milwaukee--its an unnecessary step--plus the 2nd solution.

My searches were done 1.5-2yrs ago. Everything I found said to only do the 1 calibration--except the manual. That's why people were calling Milwaukee. There is/was a conflict between the written information and what was said by other folks online. Some had called, some were just repeating--like me--but the overall consensus was its a 1 point calibration controller. Maybe that was the root of why you received the card with the controller.....

And that's the reason I call/refer to it as such. There's no need to add confusion....or typing.

My Milwaukee works Great with 1 point calibration......

[Left C]

I agree with what you are saying here 100%.

I don't use that little bitty back screw either.

I just got the impression that you were saying that it doesn't exist at all. I was just wanting to point that out and maybe I "vented" a little too much and for that I apologize.

When I got my two Milwaukee controllers I was worried that I bought a product that really wasn't that good. I wanted the Pinpoint model, but I didn't have the money for two of them at them at the time, but I had enough money for two Milwaukee units. I had two of the Azoo regulators and their needle valves aren't that consistent for stand alone use in smaller aquariums, but they work just fine with pH controllers.

Getting back to the point I want to make is that these "cheap" pH controllers and regulators have shown me that they really do a good job. It was the advent of the 4 dKH drop checkers working with these cheap units in my aquariums that really eased my worry. They really do a great job and with the 4 dKH drop checker, checking on them is a breeze.

I have since moved on to a two stage Victor regulator with an Ideal metering valve (that's a sweet combination) and that gauge blowing, solenoid sticking AP.com's "The Best" regulator finally decided to stay working.

Whoops, I'm getting off topic.

Anyway, I know where you are coming from and I agree!

Check out this actual KFC sign:

[Naja002]

I'm glad we agree, Left C. I know you're a Good Guy and do a lot to try to help others out. I do get stuff wrong, but there was/is nothing malicious in my intent with the Milwaukee Controllers. Personally, I like both of mine. The weak point that I've found on both is the probe. I bought 2 Omega probes, but 1 is now coming to the end of its useful life (maybe it just needs cleaning). Not sure I'm going to want to spend another $73 to replace it! But then, cheap probes are cheap probes....and I don't think I want to go that route either.

BTW, that page could probably use an update or 3, but then my entire website can use some updating......

[Naja002]

Also, my opinion has changed a bit these days on the PP v Milwaukee. For what we do, I think the Milwaukee works Great. The probe is cheap, so run it until its starts to go wacky, toss it and get a decent probe. To me, buying a decent probe comes with the decision to buy the Milwaukee. Sure, use the original, but get ready to toss it and get a decent probe.

Seems the PP probes are a bit better. Not necessarily Great, but better. Yet again, run'em, toss'em and get a decent probe.....

But overall my opinion of the Milwaukee pH Controllers (excluding the probe) has come way up!

[Left C]

I have a Pinpoint probe as a back up in case one dies. I was going to order an Omega probe for a backup, but I caught the Pinpoint probes when they were on sale.

The only probe that I had to replace was the one with the BBA on it. I have the Oakton pH/ORP electrode cleaner. It contains Pepsin, HCl and water. It couldn't clean it good enough so that it would stay calibrated. I probably should of soaked it in some Excel and then put it in the aquarium for the SAE's to munch on. It would probably still be working.

My probes seem to hold their calibration pretty good. They might be off ± 0.1, but that's about it.

Have you tried the Victor two stage regulators yet? They're the VTS253A-320 and VTS253B-320 medium duty regulators. They are very nice! Wherever you set the low pressure gauge, that's where it stays.