New Nutrafin cycle test - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-26-2013, 02:31 AM Thread Starter
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New Nutrafin cycle test

Hello all,
I am new to aquariums and new to this forum. A few weeks ago i took my soon to be 3 year old to the pet store and he got a kick out of all the fishies in the aquariums.
after a bit of research I decided to buy a 10 gallon aquarium early and cycle it before his birthday, I told him that on his birthday he gets to pick out a fishy.
I decided to do a fishless cycle using ammonia, i got some driftwood and some plants in there. After 2 weeks of virtually no sign of converting ammonia i decided since there is only 1 week left for his birthday that i should try a different approach. So i bought a bottle of Nutrafin Cycle, Today is day 2 of using this product and here are the results so far. I will keep you updated as time goes on.
By the way i have done some research on this product and i understand there is a chance i may always have to use this product weekly to keep my tank cycled. This is OK by me but i may test this theory as well.

Here are the results so far

2 Weeks of Fishless cycling using only Ammonia
Sunday evening Test water parameters

Ammonia 2-ppm
Nitrite 0-ppm
Nitrate 0-ppm

Add 25ml Dose of Nutrafin Cycle

Monday evening test water parameters

Ammonia 0-ppm
Nitrite 0.3-ppm
Nitrate 5-ppm

Add 10ml Nutrafin Cycle
Add 3ml Ammonia
Test for Ammonia between 2.4 and 3.7-ppm (colour in between chart)

Tuesday evening test water parameters

Ammonia 2.4ppm
Nitrite between 0.3 and 0.8-ppm
Nitrate 10-ppm

Add 10ml Nutrafin Cycle directly to filters Biowheel

Any guesses what tomorrows test results will be? Take a guess, well see whos the closest
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post #2 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-27-2013, 02:21 AM Thread Starter
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Wednesday evening
Ammonia 1.2ppm
Nitrite 1.6ppm
Nitrate 20ppm

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post #3 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-27-2013, 04:27 AM
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Looks like it is getting right down to business!

Please keep on reporting.
Add ammonia to keep returning it to 3 ppm once a day. This is more than the average fish load would create, so you are growing plenty of bacteria to deal with the ammonia.
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post #4 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-28-2013, 04:47 AM Thread Starter
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Thursday
Ammonia 1ppm
Nitrite 1.6ppm
Nitrate 35ppm
Ph 7
Temp 82f

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post #5 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-28-2013, 01:28 PM
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Does that list the bacterial strains actually used in the product?

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It's CO2. See-Oh-Two. Not C02 (see-zero-two).
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post #6 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-28-2013, 01:36 PM
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Tetra SafeStart is a great product, and usues a strain of bacteria that will hang around - you won't have to keep adding it to keep your tank cycled. If any stores near you have it I would dump a bottle in, be sure to check the expiration date on the bottom.
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post #7 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-28-2013, 01:48 PM
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I second using the Safestart, or Dr. Tim's One and Only.
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post #8 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-28-2013, 02:41 PM Thread Starter
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No Yes I have read those things, no it does not list the bacterial strains. That's why this is a test. I was unable to find tetra safestart.
My hypothesis is that nutrafin may have changed bacterial strains when they changed to the "new" cycle product. I have a hard time believing that a company that big would purposefully use the wrong kind of bacteria when the right one is available. I understand this used to be the case as the bacterias were identified by a private lab but this was the old cycle.
The bottle I am currently using is made right here in Canada and i can see the clumps of flocculated dormant bacteria.
If i made a product like this I would ask for it to be added weekly as well for 2 reasons. 1 it could only help supplement bacterial strains that may have does due to reasons such as using chlorinated water or changing filters. And 2 so I can make more money.

Edit.
The bacterial strains are
-Nitrosomonas europa
-Nitrobacter wingogradsky
-Bacillus Subtilis
-Bacillus licheniformis
-Pseudomonas stutzeri

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post #9 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-28-2013, 06:40 PM
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It has the right stuff, but I don't know why the bacillus and pseudomonas are in there. It seems that they would provide a lot of competition for the ammonia, possibly out pacing the nitro* strains.

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post #10 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-28-2013, 08:20 PM Thread Starter
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P. stutzeri's habitation of diverse environments and extensive range of metabolic functions makes it a very significant organism. As an organism that has some strains that are denitrifiers and others that are nitrogen fixers,Pseudostutzeri plays an interesting role in the nitrogen cycle.

As for the bacillus strains, those appear to be land based and i think are responsible for the protective bio film thay preserve the other 3 organisms in the bottle.

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post #11 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-29-2013, 12:33 AM Thread Starter
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Friday
Ammonia 0.3ppm
Nitrite 3.3ppm
Nitrate 50+ppm

Should i do a water change and add more ammonia? The Nitrate and Nitrite are nearing the end of my chart

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post #12 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-29-2013, 01:01 AM
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I would look into whether your dechlorinator interferes with the nutrifin. I know that eith safestart you are not supposed to use prime for a certain amount of time. This is why i suggest checking before a water change. To play it safe i would wait. The plants wont mind the nitrates. Once you are done cycling you can do enough eater changes to get it dropped before you add fish.
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post #13 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-29-2013, 03:02 AM
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I would keep running this test as if you are doing a fishless cycle.

Add ammonia daily to read 3 ppm. This is more than a reasonably stocked tank would produce, so will grow a lot of beneficial organisms.
Do water changes if the nitrite goes over 5 ppm. Nitrospira does not like high nitrite. I know your product does not contain Nitrospira, but I'll bet it is in there, growing.

When the ammonia level can be reduced to zero overnight (24 hours) and zero nitrite shows in that time, then the tank is cycled, and you can add fish. The nitrate may be sky high, so you will want to do a really big water change, or even two, back to back.
This will not hurt the bacteria: The right species live in biofilms on all the surfaces, but especially in the filter media. They do not live free in the water except for that brief time when you just added some out of the bottle. These bacteria latch on to something within 24-48 hours.

There are quite a few bacteria and other organisms that will utilize ammonia, and several groups of them will follow a similar path to the ones that we are trying to get established in the aquarium.
The other big industry that uses a similar system is the waste water plants. There are significant differences, however.

In a waste water plant the ammonia is much higher, and stays higher all the time. Constant influx of much more ammonia than is ever seen in an aquarium. The bacteria species that thrive under those conditions are a different species (or group of species) than the microorganisms that thrive in our aquariums, and live for a long time without having to add them weekly. Research into which species works under each level of ammonia has shown that it does not work to add the wrong species to the wrong setting. They get started growing as long as conditions are close to what they want, but when the tank is cycled and the ammonia is staying quite low then the 'high ammonia level' organisms die out. That is why they say you need to keep adding them.
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post #14 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-29-2013, 04:21 AM Thread Starter
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Friday evening
Added 1.5ml of ammonia
tested to 2.4ppm (close enough)
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post #15 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-29-2013, 05:15 AM Thread Starter
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I wonder if the bio-wheel harbours different bacterias vs other filters due to the access to air, i wonder if bacterias that would normally die in aquatic environments would thrive in a bio-wheel? I would be curious to see people who have had luck with bacteria in a bottle products vs people who haven't what filters they are running, bio-media etc.
I dont have any bio-media in my filter other then the bio-wheel, it doesn't look like anything is growing on it, it still looks brand new. I ust noticed there is a pretty large area behind the filter slide that could fit some bio media so i think i might buy some and throw it in there ust to cover all my bases. my button is broken.
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