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CRS SS - SSS dying off one by one .. seeking experience advice

12K views 73 replies 24 participants last post by  frontosa88 
#1 ·
hi all,

I dont post much but I go through the forums posting quite often on planted tank. I am seeking some advice in regards to why my SS ~ SSS grade CRS keeps dying off one by one. last year around the same time I started with 6 SS grade and grew the colony to about 20 SS~SSS grade CRS; today I have 6 left again. for the past 2 month i lost about 5 adult CRS.. I dont know the reason this is why I am seeking help.

I often see them get berried but for the past 7 month; eggs either have been dropped or the shrimp just end up dying.. they are molting however is molting in 1 full piece fashion (I read some where that this was bad ? suppose to molt in separate pieces?)

just test my water parameter:
ammonia = 0
ph= 7.6
nitrate = 0
Nitrite = 0
GH = 2
KH = 3
TDS = 48
temperature runs between 70-73F
I dont pump co2 however pump air only with air stone.

I am using fluval shrimp stratum substrate (going for a year now), have one giant piece of ada african with some attached java fern and java moss.

filter wise- its just the build in internal filter that came with the eheim tank. (see picture below)

I do weekly water changes of 15% -20% + top off daily because the cooling fan is on about 6 hours a day due to evap. I use RO water only and when I do perform water change i add 1 tsp of kent's RO right to bring the water chemistry back to normal status.

here is what i have found and cant seem to figure out why (and perhaps is the main reason contributing to why my shrimps are dying off slowly but surely; they're not eating much and dont move much) : PH out of the RO water jug is 6.4 .. however ph parameter in the tank as I test weekly remains 7.4 to 7.6. I dont know what is causing the PH to rise ? I dont know whether or not the substrate has lost its buffering ability or the drift wood is causing the ph rise. even if the substrate has lost the buffering ability - the RO water I put in is 6.4 why does it remain at 7.6 even after I do the water change weekly.

im all out of ideas.. any suggestion or recommendation in to what Test I should be performing to solve this problem is greatly appreciated!!!..
 

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#4 ·
thanks meppitech,

in regards to the GH level; yes i often forget to add RO right when I perform water changes.. I am thinking to double dose next water change or perhaps just add one tsp now and test water parameter tomorrow..

perhaps is the seiryu rock ? I happen to stumble upon this thread.. so I decided to give it a try; took them out put vinegar on them and its sizzling!

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=82249

thoughts or other tips anyone? or any other suggestions, comments ?

thanks!
 
#5 ·
Your gh and tds is way too low. You need to have gh 5-6, and tds of at least 100. I'm actually surprise your shrimps survived so long at such a low gh. Shrimps don't generally live long in low gh, because they generally hit molting issues and die.

If you are using ro, your kh should be zero, if your remineralizer is raising your kh, you might want to switch to a new one like salty shrimp.

Don't be so concern about the ph for now, your priority is the gh and the tds. Raise it! Worry about your ph, once you fix that. (While they prefer and breeds better inlower ph, they are perfectly fine in ph 7ish. They won't die)
 
#6 ·
The seiryu rock is likely raising your KH. I don't know if Kents RO raises KH as well as GH though (you could test your remineralized water before adding it to the tank though).

I agree that you want to lower the KH to basically 0 and raise the GH to 5. I would recommend using Salty Shrimp or Mosura Mineral Plus, I have used both of those with great success.
 
#10 ·
Your water is definitely not right. Your colony numbers should be up over 100 minimum in a year. Like others said, bite the bullet and replace the fss with a good buffering substrate, use RO and remimeralize with a shrimp specific product and get rid of rocks that will raise your kh. You want gh of 6 and kh of 0-1.

sent from an undisclosed location using morse code
 
#11 ·
The things you have not considered are harming your colony.

Things that stand out. Inadequate filtration, poor oxygenation, lack of bacteria supplementing, drastic ph swings. Active substrate is helpful but not mandatory. Fluval Shrimp stratum is not an ideal choice for substrate. One may actually have better luck with regular clown puke gravel from petco.

stability is key. weekly water changes isn't inline with that. Another thing worth keeping an eye out for is planaria or hydras. they have been known to kill shrimp over time. Hope your colony recovers soon.
 
#13 ·
All have said good stuff you need to get your kh down to 0-1. Your gh to 4-6. Your ph to 6-7. Your tds to around 140. Make sure your temps are not much more than 74-76

Also if you have Seiryu stone it will raise kh and ph. It is fine with neos by crs are allot more finicky.

I think your shrimp are dieting because they are having a hard time molting. There shells are not dense enough to shed. What do you feed are you feeding foods rich in calcium or supplement with some other form of calcium?

I would run a air stone in your ro water and do that for 48hrs and check ph and all others after that.


Sent from my iPad 3 using Tapatalk HD
 
#14 ·
Your TDS and GH are a bit low, but I don't think that's the main reason of shrimp dying They are low but you're not the only person keeping CRS in that kind of parameters, other people I know doing that are all very successful, even including some world famous breeders.

However, your KH is what's increasing your PH, and Kent RO Right does increase KH. Together with a substrate that doesn't buffer the PH low enough, your shrimps are having a hard time surviving.

From Kent RO Right product description:
Kent R/O Right Water Conditioner is a specially formulated mixture of dissolvable solids ..., together with a small amount of carbonate alkalinity (KH) to reproduce artificial river water (most aquarium fish are river fish).
 
#15 ·
Your TDS and GH are a bit low, but I don't think that's the main reason of shrimp dying They are low but you're not the only person keeping CRS in that kind of parameters, other people I know doing that are all very successful, even including some world famous breeders.
I highly doubt world class breeders keep shrimps in gh 2 and tds 45 o.o.

Honestly, I am still shocked they lived for a year.
 
#20 ·
#19 ·
i bought a 21 pound bag .. i think its enough for my 9 gallon.. how do you suggest i cycle this without another tank available? i was thinking removing the CRS to a bucket for 10-15 days.. in order for me to redo and completely swap out the substrate( i heard the initial ammonia spike is crazy...) however 2 crs are berried now.. im caught up in all these dilemma's:(:help:

was also thinking removing the internal filtration and replaced it with Amazon.com: Jardin Aquarium Fish Tank Biochemical Sponge Filter Air Pump: Pet Supplies which i already bought..
 
#27 ·
If you switch to a sponge filter, don't completely switch them. Keep your current filter running and add the sponge filter. Let the sponge filter go for several months and then if you are still considering it, remove the other filter. This way the sponge filter is cycled with BB and you don't force a mini cycle that could hurt your shrimp from losing the BB in the current filter.

I'd go the route of large bucket or tarp outside, wet and dry over the course of a few weeks to force the ammonia leech to quicken up. Then put it in a bucket with an airstone and let it run for a few more weeks to ensure that you don't get any bad feelers for your shrimp. Or just go to tractor supply, buy a 50 pound bag of black diamond and sell the amazonia to someone else :p. Am I the only who thinks it's crazy that such an expensive substrate will kill your critters if you are unaware of the ammonia spikes before using it?
 
#33 ·
Sorry to come off a bit terse as it just breaks my heart seeing all these shrimp death threads where all this information is readily available here on this forum.

I sincerely hope the owner can turn this tank around as these little guys deserve much better.
 
#35 ·
progress update

here is what i have done.. i took out the seiryu rock ... mineralize the RO water that is in my tank.. with Kents R/O right.. i added 5 TSP .. it is crazy because in the instruction it states only add 1 tsp per 5 gallon and i only have a 9 gallon tank but having added 5 tsp of kents RO right my water parameter as of 5 min ago reads:

PH : unchanged still at 7.6 in tank (NO IDEA why) out of the ro water jug PH is 6.4
GH: 4 even having to add 5 tsp of it from yesterday till today
TDS: 120 (raised it i guess by adding ro right up from 50's)
KH: 3 unchanged

I bought some bee's shrimp mineral GH+ and will get it next week..

the parameter did change some .. GH went up by 1 and tds up at 120 however I am having to add so much Kents RO right .. makes me wonder how kent come up with these intructions.. yesterday i went to water place and bought another five gallon of RO water and i immediately added 6 tsp of kents ro right.. it brought the TDS from 4 to 124 GH seems to only be at 2-3 KH0 and PH at 6.4 (just dont seem as potent as it states in the back of the RO right bottle 4 tsp chaging the water of a 5 gallon from very soft to very hard.. its just not true).

what should i do now? continue to dose RO right ? or water change?

thanks guys!
 
#41 ·
here is what i have done.. i took out the seiryu rock ... mineralize the RO water that is in my tank.. with Kents R/O right.. i added 5 TSP .. it is crazy because in the instruction it states only add 1 tsp per 5 gallon and i only have a 9 gallon tank but having added 5 tsp of kents RO right my water parameter as of 5 min ago reads:

PH : unchanged still at 7.6 in tank (NO IDEA why) out of the ro water jug PH is 6.4
GH: 4 even having to add 5 tsp of it from yesterday till today
TDS: 120 (raised it i guess by adding ro right up from 50's)
KH: 3 unchanged

I bought some bee's shrimp mineral GH+ and will get it next week..

the parameter did change some .. GH went up by 1 and tds up at 120 however I am having to add so much Kents RO right .. makes me wonder how kent come up with these intructions.. yesterday i went to water place and bought another five gallon of RO water and i immediately added 6 tsp of kents ro right.. it brought the TDS from 4 to 124 GH seems to only be at 2-3 KH0 and PH at 6.4 (just dont seem as potent as it states in the back of the RO right bottle 4 tsp chaging the water of a 5 gallon from very soft to very hard.. its just not true).

what should i do now? continue to dose RO right ? or water change?

thanks guys!
i keep the lights on for about 4-5 hours a day .. does this have anything to do with contributing to high KH? there is fairly large amount of agitation from the internal filter on the water surface.. just trying to figure out why the KH is high at 3 - thus high PH
 
#40 ·
It is used to lower ph. Borneowild sell them in gravel form (borneowild humid). The eBay one is in powder form so it clouded my tank for like a few hours. I just try to soak it in water first and then pour it in. But I think you're on the right track using aqua soil though.
 
#42 ·
update

as of now.. even after water change.. tanks water parameter:

GH = 4 (with a whole lot of kent's RO right 6 tsp)
KH = 3
PH 7.6
TDS 140(up from 48 because of massive amount of Ro right ive been adding)


tested the parameter of the RO water which i buy from a local water store (with RO right premixed) prior to performing the water change.

GH-4
KH-0 (whats strange here is that RO right did not alter the KH which makes me wonder even more why the high KH in tank)
PH.6.4
TDS 135

can someone comment on why the change in KH and PH specifically? these are the two biggest headache and main problem in my tank.. someone reported that substratpro media though glass inert properties causes PH to go up ? worn out substrate not buffering causing the PH to rise?

thanks alot!
 
#43 ·
Your kh is so high because of the seriyu stone, and I believe someone commented that the Kent ro right has a small amount of kh in it. The elevated level of kh is causing you pH to be higher. With a kh of 3 any acids in the tank have a much harder time lowering the pH because the kh acts as a buffer for the. Even though you removed the stone it will take many water changes to bring your kh down.
In my royal blue, oebt tank I had 10 pounds of seriyu stone in a 12 long. I used ro/di remineralized with shirakura ca+. The kh of my water change water was always a kh of 0. But because of the stone I always had a kh of 3 and a pH of 7.4. These have proven to be pretty perfect conditions for tigers but obviously are not ideal for crystals.
Your shrimp have been living in these conditions for a long time now and there are many things you were not doing correctly. I would only change about 10% of your water twice a week, dripping the new water in, until you reach a good level. A quick change in parameters could be even more detrimental to your shrimp than the conditions they are currently living in.
I would Google, kh,gh, tds and pH and try to learn as much about water chemistry as possible. I believe a huge part of my success has been because I understand the fundamentals of how water chemistry works.
 
#48 ·
ROCK is out...
SUBSTRATE... i can't do anything about at this moment.. ADA aqua soil is still sitting in the bag.. :icon_sad:

i got the eheim tort peat coming on tuesday though.. ill put a small pouch in the internal filtration system and hope it brings a temp solution to lowering KH and PH a bit.
 
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