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Another Plant Problem Thread - S. Repens and Marsilea Crenata

2K views 10 replies 4 participants last post by  sdwindansea 
#1 ·
I'm still very new to planted tanks. This is a non-C02 setup but I am dosing Excel every other day (5 ml). The tank is a 60 gallon tank that is 17" tall (48" long x 15" deep). I'm running a single Planted+ 24/7 on a custom setting (approximately 80% white/red) for 7 hours a day. The tank is about 45 days old now. When I setup the tank I added small amount of oscomote plus to the bottom of the tank before adding the Eco-complete (~3").

I am using tap water and I'm dosing 10 ml of macros/micros once per week. This is the nilocg DIY liquid solution (DIY EI Liquid Fertilizer| Premium Aquarium Fertilizer | NilocG Aquatics). The recommended EI dosing would be 5 ml per 20 gallons three times per week. I'm trying to be cautious and do not want to overdose.

I did measure nitrates and phosphates after my last major water change (~ 50%). The nitrates were 10 ppm and the phosphates were 0.5 ppm. I have not calibrated the API test kit yet though.

It seems like my Marsilea crenata and Staurogyne repens are both suffering and lacking in something. Based on the description/pictures do you think it is too much fertilizer dosing? Not enough? Should I be using root tabs yet? Thanks for any help you can give, it is great appreciated.



 
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#3 ·
Thanks @natemcnutty. The roots are still working their way down. Both plants were added to the tank about 2 weeks ago. I was assuming I was going easy on the light but that could be a bad assumption. Also I do not think it is burning since the repens has holes on a few of the lower leaves (I know it is hard to see in the bad picture I took).
 
#4 ·
Excellent. Here are a few thoughts :)

First, Excel (glutaraldehyde) breaks down in about 21 hours and should be dosed in the morning if possible. 5 ml is a good dose for that size tank, and if you run out of Excel, you should look into Metricide 14 which is the same thing but a little more concentrated.

Second, with EI, the point is to slightly overdose the tank so you can't run into deficiency issues. 10 ppm nitrates tells me you are dosing fairly lean. Not sure what your plant density is, but you can try increasing it slightly. Also, those EI ferts are macro and micro on separate days (to avoid precipitation) so that each is dosed 3 time a week.

Finally, if you are having holes in leaves, that is a potassium deficiency and dosing a bit more macros will help with that.

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#5 ·
Thanks yet again @natemcnutty, I really appreciate. The tank is setup as low tech in that there is not any C02 so I was under the impression I shouldn't do a full EI dosing. Instead maybe once or twice a week. I can definitely up the doseage of macros (and micros), I was just afraid of overdosing. I could also add potassium phosphate (KH2PO4) or potassium sulfate (K2SO4) individually as I have both of these in dry ferts as well. When you say there is a potential deficiency in potassium is it the phosphate, sulfate or both?

Here is a picture of the full tank so you know what I mean by lightly planted. With this type of setup are root tabs recommended/necessary at some point?

 
#6 ·
I think you are not dosing enough. If the recommended dosing is 5ml per 20 gal you should be using 15 ml for 60gal and you are only doing that once a week as opposed to three times per week, right? Yellowing plants look to me like they are hungry, also indicated by the low nitrate level you have (when my nitrates test below 20ml/gal I dose).

I thought the same thing when I started using EI, that I should start out dosing lean to avoid algae issues. My plants didn't do well at all until I started doing the recommended levels. The 50% water change that goes along w/EI is supposed to keep nutrients from building up to excess.
 
#10 ·
I realize now that I didn't say 5 ml per each day! With low light and the plant density you have, I'd be doing at minimum 5 ml each day alternating between macro and micro.

Toxicity from overdosing takes quite a bit, and dosing less than full EI won't give you any issues. The idea behind EI is that you purposefully put more ferts into the water column than needed and then reset the levels each week with a 50% water change to avoid to much buildup. This ensures you have no deficiencies, but it means you have to keep up with those water changes ;)
 
#8 ·
You can up the dose gradually. Maybe start by dosing 15ml at least once a week, see if there is any improvement. If some plants still look bad, start doing that twice/three times per week. There might be a lag in response, though- the plants might not look different for a week or two.
 
#9 ·
Good advice has been given. I have no experience with m crenata, but in my experience with plants and especially S repens, (plants with good root systems,) root tabs are great in a young tank or with recent additions to get them going. You do have osmocote and eco so that MAY be irrelevant. But a root tab or two may help and wouldn't hurt and once the plants get going, you should not need any more tabs. I usually add tabs once or twice in the recommended interval in my inert tanks and they are usually not needed thereafter.

I could be wrong here, someone else will correct me if so...but plants with finer roots like s. repens take much longer to establish themselves in gravel like substrates vs sand like substrates....Based on my experiences. It is still a young tank and the plants may just need time to adapt and establish themselves...as well as what other members have suggested. I also see benefits from dosing excel daily, maybe in smaller amounts though. Do take your time increasing doses like suggested. And although this is a different story, don't panic if you get some algae. If the plants aren't fully established and adapted, increasing ferts could potentially cause algae, hence why it was recommended to slowly increase dosing.


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#11 ·
Thanks yet again. I will change out the dosing regiment to be 5 ml every other day of macros/micros after the water change this Sunday. I have been diligent with the water changes. I will also look into root tabs as well. Again, I really appreciate all of the help, I would be lost without this forum :).
 
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