Plant Leaves Keeps Falling Off/Melting - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-13-2016, 12:12 PM Thread Starter
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Plant Leaves Keeps Falling Off/Melting

Hi guys,

I hope you could help me in identifying what sort of nutrient is lacking in my planted tank. I have setup my tank for about 4 months now and everything is doing well until I noticed my Nitrate has dropped significantly from 5ppm to almost 0ppm. I have dosed Seachem Nitrogen to achieve 5ppm and it did. However, few days after that, I noticed that my plants leaves specially the Hydrocotyle Tripartita are falling off. I have observed that it is rotting/melting from the based of the leaf. Also, the leaves are turning brow or having some brown patches.

Here are my parameters:

Tank size: 50 Gal Long
Light: 4x T5 HO Tube (2x 6500 and 2x 6700)
Nitrate: 5ppm
Phosphate: 0.50 to 0.75

Ferts Dosing Schedule:
Seachem Flourish - Sun
Seachem Iron - Sun, Tues, Thurs, Sat
Seachem Potassium - Sun, Mon, Wed, Fri
Seachem Trace - Wed
Seachem Nitrogen - Sun
Seachem Phosphate - Sun, Mon, Tues, Wed, Thurs, Fri, Sat (my tank bottoms up of phosphate easily)

I hope the photos would also help.

Thank in advance,

Regards,

Juriboy
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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-13-2016, 12:57 PM
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I'm new to a planted tank but it sure seems to me that you're over dosing (Seachem loves you!).
I think you should be fine with Flourish Trace and Comprehensive and maybe some root tabs and not all the other stuff regularly. Are there fish in there?
For what it's worth, I think I would do a few water changes.
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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-13-2016, 01:09 PM
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Hello Juriboy,

It would help to know how much do you dose of each nutrient, preferably in ppm (mg/L).
What filtration /pumps your setup has
How powerful the light is ( in W) and for how long it is on

Another aspect I do not see any details about is CO2 ???

Here are my thought, previously your plants were limited in growth by the scarcity of N. Once you started dosing N, your plants starting growing until they hit the next limiting factor. I have seen similar symptoms, several times when CO2 and or water flow was reduced in that area. Start with these 2 factors and see if the plants health is improving.

Many members here, myself included, keep their aquariums at about 20ppm NO3, and 1ppm PO4. Thus, i would not think of a toxic overdose. You can read more about one approach of dosing here: http://www.barrreport.com/forum/barr...-for-test-kits

Regards,
Mike
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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-13-2016, 01:33 PM
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According to this chart:



From this thread:

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/10.../topics/184368


An Odysea 2 bulb fixture is 50 par at 19". If you have a standard 50 gallon, thats how high your tank is. 50 Par is Medium/High light?. If you have a 4 bulb fixture, you have very high light, maybe too high. If you are going to be running that high of light, you need to make sure that your co2 level is a solid 30 ppm. You probably should look into EI dosing dry fertilizers:

_Dosing Regimes_

Standard 10 Gallon (20 x12x12).
Low tech, Sand substrate.
Eheim 2211, w/Purigen and Aqueon Quietflow 10.
Finnex Stingray LED, 20" above substrate
Anubias, Narrow leaf Hygro, Christmas moss.
6 Kubotai Rasboras, 2 amano's and 11 Blue Neocardia shrimp.
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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-16-2016, 07:48 AM Thread Starter
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Thank you guys for your feedback. I will answer your queries as accurate as I could...


@AbbeysDad - As much as I would want to convert to EI Dosing, unfortunately this is not a option for me here in Singapore. I would need a license just to purchase Potassium Nitrate as the powder itself could be used as an explosive. So yeah, Seachem profits a lot from me haha!

@dukydaf - For my filtration, I am using Hagen Fluval 206 and a powerhead. For lighting, I am using Odyssea T5 HO 39W (3 ft), 4 bulbs. That's 156W in total running 8 hours daily. Two bulbs are not just enough for my Monte Carlo.

Here's my dosing routine:

Seachem Flourish (4mg/L) - Sun
Seachem Iron (5mg/L) - Sun, Tues, Thurs, Sat
Seachem Potassium (8mg/L) - Sun, Mon, Wed, Fri
Seachem Trace (11mg/L) - Wed
Seachem Nitrogen (10mg/L) - Sun
Seachem Phosphate (15ng/L) - Sun, Mon, Tues, Wed, Thurs, Fri, Sat (my tank bottoms up of phosphate easily)

As for CO2, I have not yet to measure it. I do try to maintain a lime green color on my drop checker though. I inject CO2 via a cylinder tank with solenoid via in-line atomic diffuser.

@livingword26 - yes, I will drop-by the LFS later to get a CO2 test kit. As I mentioned above, 2 bulbs of T5 HO (39W) is not really enough and you are correct that it is about 50 PAR in my aquarium. I need to run 100 PAR in order for the Monte Carlo to grow.


Regards,

Edson
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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-16-2016, 01:13 PM
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Well, I'll be the first to admit that I don't know everything, but I do not believe anything needs a 100 par to grow. You have had your tank up for 4 months, and not run into any algae problems, that is great in itself. I am afraid, however, if you are indeed running in the 100 par range, that you are in for some surprises. Dosing Flouish Nitrogen once a week, will not be enough for a very high light, co2 injected aquarium. Also, read the specs on Seachems websight, Flourish trace is just watered down Flourish, and serves no real purpose. I would highly recommend also reading on the threads I posted above. Best of luck to you.

Standard 10 Gallon (20 x12x12).
Low tech, Sand substrate.
Eheim 2211, w/Purigen and Aqueon Quietflow 10.
Finnex Stingray LED, 20" above substrate
Anubias, Narrow leaf Hygro, Christmas moss.
6 Kubotai Rasboras, 2 amano's and 11 Blue Neocardia shrimp.
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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-16-2016, 01:18 PM
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Yeah , monte carlo definitely does not need 100 par to grow.
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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-16-2016, 10:50 PM
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According to the "Fertilator" at Aquatic Plant Central,

Aquatic Plant Central


These are the recommended dosage levels:

Nitrate 10-20 ppm
Phosphate 0.5-2 ppm
Potassium 10-20 ppm
Calcium 10-30 ppm
Magnesium 2-5 ppm
Iron 0.1 ppm

I wouldn't let anything you are capable of testing fall below those minimums. Since you can't test for all of them, unless you have more money than me, you should do a 50% Water change every week to keep from building up anything. You can't use the website above specifically for dosing, because it does not give examples for the Flourish line, but Seachem has its own calculator which can help you dose appropriately. :

Seachem - Dose Calculators

Standard 10 Gallon (20 x12x12).
Low tech, Sand substrate.
Eheim 2211, w/Purigen and Aqueon Quietflow 10.
Finnex Stingray LED, 20" above substrate
Anubias, Narrow leaf Hygro, Christmas moss.
6 Kubotai Rasboras, 2 amano's and 11 Blue Neocardia shrimp.
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-16-2016, 10:53 PM
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Melting usually means not enough light. Double check your CO2 levels as well and frequent water changes wouldn't hurt either (i'd go with 10-25% vs 50%.
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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-19-2016, 07:58 AM Thread Starter
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@livingword26 and @bsantucci - thanks guys for the inputs and links. Honestly, I am not actually sure if my light fixture is overkill in my 50 US Gal Long tank (36x18x18 = inches). I used to have just 1 fixture and my hairgrass that time all turned dark green and did not carpet at all even when it was planted for more than a month. I was told that my light was not enough. Hence, the second light fixture. I have attached a photo of my fixture below. So far, no algae and all the GSA have already disappeared after I dosed 15mg/L Seachem Phosphorus everyday.

Yes, I took a look at the Fertilator. I will attempt to achieve the recommended dosage tomorrow morning and see if this would stop the plants from having stem rot and from dropping of leaves. Thank you guys so much! You've been such a great help.
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post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-19-2016, 08:11 AM
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Four T5 HO bulb's at 18 inches is too much light IMHO
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post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-19-2016, 11:38 AM
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Hi, another member from Singapore called XiaoZhuang doses with dry fertilisers he says he buys them from Amazon and Hydroponics shops. I would give him a message to find out where he gets them so you can save some money and such . I'm from Malaysia, so hello neighbour!
Also, you can use calculators like (rotala butterfly) to figure out how to dose to EI levels or any target ppm you want with Seachem fertilisers.


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post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old 05-19-2016, 05:03 PM
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Though you might find this interesting:

Iron Deficiency in Ludwigia sp. Deficiency Finder


It looks to me like your plants are showing signs of several nutrient deficiencies.

Standard 10 Gallon (20 x12x12).
Low tech, Sand substrate.
Eheim 2211, w/Purigen and Aqueon Quietflow 10.
Finnex Stingray LED, 20" above substrate
Anubias, Narrow leaf Hygro, Christmas moss.
6 Kubotai Rasboras, 2 amano's and 11 Blue Neocardia shrimp.
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