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post #16 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-07-2010, 04:59 PM
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bah! it never pays to be devils advocate
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post #17 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-07-2010, 05:32 PM
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You made me ! I was just kidding about all that stuff!

Now, if you'll excuse me I need my coffee enema this morning then I'll need to see my guru to get my chakras realigned and later today a feng shui specialist is coming over to redo the living room and I need to get a refill on my colloidal silver because you can't trust the medical establishment and looking like a smurf from years of dosing the stuff is sexy this year .
TWO more Urban Legends...
the need for water changes
the need for quarantining
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post #18 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-07-2010, 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted by mylittlefish View Post
TWO more Urban Legends...
the need for water changes
the need for quarantining
Actually there are good reasons to do water changes, for some situations, and good reasons not to do water changes for other situations. Quarantining new fish is a very good idea, when you are adding a few fish to a tank with many fish, especially fish that are valuable to you. But, if you just have a few feeder guppies in the tank, and are adding a school of rummy nose tetras, for example, I see no good reason to quarantine the tetras.

But, I don't see much of any reason to quarantine plants.

Hoppy
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post #19 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-07-2010, 09:25 PM
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TWO more Urban Legends...
the need for water changes
the need for quarantining
The third urban legend...

Crack Kills.
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post #20 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-08-2010, 04:04 PM
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I bought 250 grams of tourmaline at a gem show. Crushed it into sand, laid it down on the bottom of my tank. I wasn't going to buy the Ada tourmaline bc which is tourmaline dust and powdered carbon.

I paid $30 but when crushed it was shiny inside, shards of crystals of blue and green!

Bought 250 grams of the Ada stuff for about $18. Did the same. It was just black... No crystals. Much lower quality... But I paid much less than what I got at a gem show.

If anyone would like to see the Californian tourmaline I crushed and look at the pretty crystals, here it is along with a pic of what Ada sells for you filter. The Californian stuff I bought Looked the same before it was crushed. When I crushed the Ada stuff, there were NO crystals inside. Much lower quality in my opinion.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/ta...p-journal.html



This rough tourmaline is called Schorl. You can buy like three pounds of it on ebay for like $20! It's like tourmaline ore and not gem quality tourmaline.... But the same if not better as the schorl that ADA sells,

Do I KNOW it does anything? Nope. Do I think it does anything? I do... I buy into the whole ionization stuff. There is tourmaline in my hair brush, too.

Do I think I need a pound of crushed tourmaline sand in my ADA aquasoil? Absolutely not. Its in there just in case there are any benefits at all.

I call total BS on it being used to slowly supply lithium and boron or whatever Tourmaline is made of. Schorl is a rock. The minerals aren't bioavailable. Tourmaline has electrical properties, and as a geek I think that's cool, but it more than likely doesn't do anything for the aquarium or my hairbrush for that matter.

But it's there just in case, and thats why I choose to spend money on things like that.

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post #21 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-09-2010, 03:22 AM
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Originally Posted by ukamikazu View Post
Tom, you're killing me. Please don't make me put the flame retardant underwear back on, it's itchy and I'm really trying to make friends and contacts here and I don't think I have it in me to get involved in this again even if I'm not being that incendiary like last time.

If they come back again, I'm hiding behind you .
"Tough acting" Tenactin works for jock itch too.

Regards,
Tom Barr

Regards,
Tom Barr
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post #22 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-09-2010, 03:27 AM
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Originally Posted by ClintonSParsons View Post
I bought 250 grams of tourmaline at a gem show. Crushed it into sand, laid it down on the bottom of my tank. I wasn't going to buy the Ada tourmaline bc which is tourmaline dust and powdered carbon.

I paid $30 but when crushed it was shiny inside, shards of crystals of blue and green!

Bought 250 grams of the Ada stuff for about $18. Did the same. It was just black... No crystals. Much lower quality... But I paid much less than what I got at a gem show.

If anyone would like to see the Californian tourmaline I crushed and look at the pretty crystals, here it is along with a pic of what Ada sells for you filter. The Californian stuff I bought Looked the same before it was crushed. When I crushed the Ada stuff, there were NO crystals inside. Much lower quality in my opinion.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/ta...p-journal.html



This rough tourmaline is called Schorl. You can buy like three pounds of it on ebay for like $20! It's like tourmaline ore and not gem quality tourmaline.... But the same if not better as the schorl that ADA sells,

Do I KNOW it does anything? Nope. Do I think it does anything? I do... I buy into the whole ionization stuff. There is tourmaline in my hair brush, too.

Do I think I need a pound of crushed tourmaline sand in my ADA aquasoil? Absolutely not. Its in there just in case there are any benefits at all.

I call total BS on it being used to slowly supply lithium and boron or whatever Tourmaline is made of. Schorl is a rock. The minerals aren't bioavailable. Tourmaline has electrical properties, and as a geek I think that's cool, but it more than likely doesn't do anything for the aquarium or my hairbrush for that matter.

But it's there just in case, and thats why I choose to spend money on things like that.
Oh, you are a Penac fan also?
"Biodynamic" farming.

We gots plenty of them in the wine growers out here these days.
Good example of going too far one direction.

Organic, local, small farmers, I can buy into that.
Fruity stuff, nope. It incurs my full wrath.

But this is true for most things, not just aquariums.

Regards,
Tom Barr

Regards,
Tom Barr
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post #23 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-09-2010, 04:56 AM
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Wow I feel smarter from just reading this thread. It's has quite a bit of large words that I don't understand. I think it's crap myself but I'll leave the door open in case I'm wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.

I am prepared to meet my Maker. Whether my Maker is prepared for the great ordeal of meeting me is another matter.
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post #24 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-10-2010, 12:47 AM
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Tom, actually I am looking into Penac-W. Why? Because it doesn't hurt anything, and because it costs $0.14 per gram, and because a bottle will last me two years. At $0.14 per gram and a life span of two years on my sized tank, I don't care if you think it's bogus. If it has subtle effects, then yeah I can afford it at that price. I know Amano endorses the Plocher energy system, and I don't believe he would attach his name/his company's name to something he did not believe in. Even if it is mere Bentonite, I am paying for great quality Bentonite and I'll feel good about adding it.

As for Penac-P, I'm not going to buy a 200 gram bottle when I only need six grams and it's only good to lay down once and is not meant to be dosed after that. I wont pay for 200 grams when I need six. If anyone would like to sell me six grams, let me know.

If I could find Penac-A, those little stick things, I'd buy some of them, too. Can't find them in America.

Basically, Tom, at the end of the day I'm paying for peace of mind. It's worth a lot to me, and that's what I'm paying for.

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post #25 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-10-2010, 04:29 AM
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Originally Posted by ClintonSParsons View Post
Tom, actually I am looking into Penac-W. Why? Because it doesn't hurt anything, and because it costs $0.14 per gram, and because a bottle will last me two years.
Basically, Tom, at the end of the day I'm paying for peace of mind. It's worth a lot to me, and that's what I'm paying for.
Yes, so would a good book.

Does not hurt anything in the tank either ....since this is argument for your ruler/metric for scrutiny. This is the best support for the argument you can come up with?? So you wanna go with...........superstition?

These are the very same arguments used to sell diet pills that do not work, Water ionizers, and every snake oil I've seen in this hobby the last 30 some odd years. Show me they work as stated, not your superstition.

Cost? Does not matter if it has no effect to begin with.

Mark Twain stated that marketing was nothing more than crooks trying to get people to spend money on stuff they do not need... with money they do not have. Come to think of it, a good book might help actually more.
I'll hang on to my $ for things a lot more tangible. If nothing else, for the principle alone.

As far as water ionization, quackery about tourmaline...

http://www.chem1.com/CQ/wonkywater.html

So what else you got for the debate?
Anything good or more of the same??



Regards,
Tom Barr

Regards,
Tom Barr
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post #26 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-10-2010, 04:42 AM
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The difference between you and I is that I don't really care for a vehement debate. I'm just not that passionate. I'd rather spend my thirty bucks and be happy, I guess. As a bio major with an interest in Botany (want to go into the field) I'd still buy and use tourmaline and penac, just in case. As a PROFESSIONAL, I'd never use or recommend tourmaline or Penac if I was being paid to advise someone. As a HOBBYIST, I am happy to use them because no ones money is at stake but my own. Take that as you will.

Superstition? Absolutely. Personally I believe in chi, other spiritual things, etc.

If you don't, that's totally cool and I respect that, too. Not everything has to be a hardcore debate, tom. It's all cool. I will throw away my money and be happy, you can save your money and say I should not be happy and I threw away my money.

At the end of the day, I spent next to nothing on something that probably doesn't do anything of testable benefit, but I'm happy and content, and you have $30 more than I did.

Clint

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post #27 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-10-2010, 05:14 AM
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The only supernatural thing tom barr believes in, is TOM BARR!!!

For christs sake, clinton, he's a DOCTOR!!!

lol, but really... Who cares, if something gives you peace of mind, do it! If you are concerned that you're spending money on ONLY peace of mind, then work that problem out with toms help.

In the meantime, if you wish, I'll write penac on a 6 gram bag of montmorillonite and send it to you!
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post #28 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-10-2010, 05:18 AM
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No no no, see, it has to have the hologram imprinted on it or else I am not interested. How else are plants supposed to know what they are supposed to act like for optimal health number one good luck time?



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post #29 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-10-2010, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by ClintonSParsons View Post
No no no, see, it has to have the hologram imprinted on it or else I am not interested. How else are plants supposed to know what they are supposed to act like for optimal health number one good luck time?


An ADA Hologram i assume /just read your tank journal.

I see where you're coming from. More of an "act of good faith" than a scientifically proven fact. Same concept as hanging a cross over your door or arranging your furniture to ensure proper "energy flow".
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post #30 of 36 (permalink) Old 11-10-2010, 12:37 PM
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I found a rock that keeps bears away, I can sell it for $10...it should bring great peace of mind to you.
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