Ps I own 2 terriers I am well versed in stubborn and defiant dogs.
No. You're talking about medium level defiant dogs. You don't EVER need to punish a dog like that physically.
I rehabilitate dogs that have bitten and mauled people. OVERLY aggressive dogs.
I work with HUNTING
dogs. Dogs that refuse to obey for treats, let alone acknowledge your commands or positive reinforcements.
Prison-caliber dogs for lack of a better metaphor. Not small-time sheltered rebel dogs like yours.