Hagen ladder w/ two 2liters? - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-29-2004, 05:43 PM Thread Starter
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Hagen ladder w/ two 2liters?

I seem to remember a thread somewhere about bubbles from two bottles crashing into each other if one hagen ladder was used for two 2 liter bottles. I have not been able to find that thread again.

Is this an issue if I use one ladder and put a tee at the top of the tubing entering the ladder to connect the two bottles? Or do I need a seperate diffuser for each bottle?

Thanks for the help once again.

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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-29-2004, 05:56 PM
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Shay,
I hooked two Hagen bottles to a single ladder (using a T) and found that the larger bubble (created by combining the bottles) dissolved only to the point that a bubble from a single bottle would have. In other words, the CO2 from the second bottle is essentially wasted as that's the size of the bubble that exits the top of the ladder.

I now have the two Hagen bottles connected (again with a T) directly to the intake of a Magnum 350 filter and never see any bubbles exiting the filter's outlet tube. I probably should move to a 2 liter bottle but I hate wasting stuff I already bought (the Hagen bottles).

Bill
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-29-2004, 06:37 PM
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I would look into making a DIY reactor. I haven't had much luck with hagen ladders. They are about as good as it gets for a passive diffuser, but they can't touch the effectiveness of a good reactor.

Matt

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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-30-2004, 07:18 PM
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The ladders are great for smaller tanks where you would want less than 60 bubbles per minute. I have them in my 10 gallon tanks connected to my pressurized system. My larger tanks all have 'power' reactors that force the mixing of CO2 and water.

Don't be fooled into thinking you are wasting CO2 just because a bubble makes it to the top. A lot of gas exchange occurs in that bubble and when it gets to the top of the ladder most of the CO2 has been replaced with nitrogen and oxygen.

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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-30-2004, 07:44 PM Thread Starter
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So, I've nixed the ladder idea and have moved onto the reactor. Which raised a lot of new questions. I could not find an adequate submersible pump at my local lfs. I'm wondering now if I can use a submerisible filter and force water flow into the top of a gravel vac to force the co2 to dissolve or does it have to be air?

Thanks again.

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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-30-2004, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shay
So, I've nixed the ladder idea and have moved onto the reactor. Which raised a lot of new questions. I could not find an adequate submersible pump at my local lfs. I'm wondering now if I can use a submerisible filter and force water flow into the top of a gravel vac to force the co2 to dissolve or does it have to be air?

Thanks again.
Don't get me wrong shay, like I stated above, the ladder is about the best passive diffuser out there. It does work. I have had good results running two 2 liters on a ladder and not had the problem mentioned above (I always had about as good of dissolution as possible with the ladder).

As for the submersible filter, I wouldn't see where it wouldn't work. Really all you are wanting is a good flow of water to churn the bubbles around in the gravel vac. As long as the filter gives you a good output into the gravel vac I think it should work.

Matt

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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-30-2004, 09:07 PM Thread Starter
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Great. I'm going to give the reactor a shot then with the submersible filter and see how it works out.

Shay

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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-31-2004, 05:29 PM Thread Starter
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THe Co2 is up and running . I couldn't use the filter so I had to go with the ladder temporarily until I get the parts for the reactor. It seems to be working well but the bubbles are coming out pretty slowly and then bumping into each other 1/2 way up the ladder to form one big bubble.

Also one of the two liters looks dangerously close to the top whereas the other one has three inches of air between the liquid and the cap.

One thing is certain, I'm learning a lot and having fun.

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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-31-2004, 06:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shay
THe Co2 is up and running . I couldn't use the filter so I had to go with the ladder temporarily until I get the parts for the reactor. It seems to be working well but the bubbles are coming out pretty slowly and then bumping into each other 1/2 way up the ladder to form one big bubble.
Grats on getting the CO2 up and running.. If the ladder is new and hasn't been used, it takes time to create a film over the ladder rutts so that the bubbles will roll smoothly. Give it some time and it should work it's way out to where it dissolves more properly in the ladder.

Matt

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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 05-31-2004, 06:28 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks Corigan. In the meantime I'm going to work on getting together the reactor.

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