DIY LED Pendants brainstorming. Multichip? Vero18? help me! - The Planted Tank Forum
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post #1 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-13-2016, 10:11 AM Thread Starter
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DIY LED Pendants brainstorming. Multichip? Vero18? help me!

so been researching lighting for a bit for my 120 Gallon 60x18x27 build i'm working on. its going to be setup as a anubias tank with a riparium above the tank. want to light both the tank and the ripirium with some hanging lights. original plan was getting a couple 30" beamswork 2 row 3watt lights building a box so light spill in front and behind the tank would be controlled and suspending it a couple feet above the tank. I was unsure how much light would make it to the bottom of 47 inches, tank is anubias only but still want solid growth so need 30-40 par at the substrate.

I have been seeing some multichip LED projects and they seem like something I might be able to accomplish, especially a VERO18 build which keeps my not so great soldering skills away from the lighty bits. would you guys think 2 VERO 18 5600k CRI90 chips with 50 degree reflectors hung 2ft above my tank would push enough light down to the substrate? also I really want to have it programmable with sunrise sunset, but i'm not seeing a easy but cheap method like the TC420/sunsetter option I was looking at with the beamswork option. any thoughts? open to ideas.
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post #2 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-13-2016, 02:52 PM
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TC-420 and apparently most "strip" dimmers can be used w/ LDD drivers.
Unfortunately it is a "little bits" solder.
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post #3 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-14-2016, 04:07 AM Thread Starter
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yeah I might go that route. would love someone to kinda give me some direction here is what i'm thinking just not most up on electronics to make confident component choices. also the bluefin mini or storm controllers caught my eye but also not completly sure of what I need to get that all up and running.

I see a lot of the people who used the VERO led arrays mixed the 2700k and 5600k LEDs. if I got just the 5600k CRI90 leds would it look washed out?
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post #4 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-14-2016, 04:51 AM
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Almost by definition, high CRI LED's will not render things washed out.
Most mix color temps for 1)sunrise/sunset effects and 2) supplement high photosynthetic red w/out toning the tank too warm.

Component choices are relatively easy as to the drive hardware (power supplies exceeding voltage needs of the LED's, LDD-h drivers, controller ect.)


50 degree lenses 2ft above the tank gives you a "cone" at the water line of 22".. requiring 3 to cover the 60" tank..

Now using a Kessil as a "baseline" since it is the best "COB" I can pick..you shouldn't have much a problem w/ getting PAR down there IF it is fairly close to equiv (fairly big claim but not out of the realm of possibility)

SPECTRA

forcing the calculator to a 50 degree lens and at 42" (106cm approx) calc estimates PAR at 60-ish..w 34W of LED's..

Doesn't seem out of the realm of possibility..

DIY Bridgelux Vero 18 LED build
Quote:
I took a preliminary PAR reading of one Vero 18 with the Brooke-W and at 1000ma and 2ft high I got 165 PAR. This was done open air. For reference my old 9x Rebel ES cannon with 6x 6500K, 1x cool blue, 1x red, and 1x hyper violet got 150 PAR at that same distance in the tank with 60deg optics. At 1000ma the Vero 18 is only running at 33% power as it can go up to 3000ma. My goal is 60 PAR @ 3ft from substrate.
5000k 90CRI.. driven at 1000mA 29.5V 3885 lumens..
(29.5W effective)
BXRC-50G4000-F-24
BXRC-50G4000-F-24 Bridgelux | Optoelectronics | DigiKey

$11.21 each.. Get 4 if you are in doubt..
36V power supply (150W) 4 LDD-h's @ 1000mA, optics, heat sinks and controller
40 or 60 degree..
LED reflector family OP07520-C1C - LUMOTRIX


And no, 2 is not enough for FULL coverage and that PAR..
Each pendant "unit" will probably run $40-$60 (chip,lens,driver,heat sink)..

LPF6768-ZHP Bridgelux Pin Fin LED Cooler 67mm
LED Heatsink R186-70 - heat sinks
NX501105 Aavid Thermalloy | Optoelectronics | DigiKey
$25 passive heat sink.. ..not cheap..
some choices...but not necessarily easy nor cheap-ish.
mrfiock likes this.

"A man with a watch knows what time it is. A man with two watches is never sure."

Last edited by jeffkrol; 12-14-2016 at 05:25 AM. Reason: edit
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post #5 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-14-2016, 03:28 PM Thread Starter
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awesome thanks for the info, gave me something to think about.

now i'm assuming i'd be better off getting a 48V powersupply and say a 3up board with some 1000ma drivers to drive it compared ot 3 seperate drivers that have AC input?
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post #6 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-14-2016, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kampo View Post
awesome thanks for the info, gave me something to think about.

now i'm assuming i'd be better off getting a 48V powersupply and say a 3up board with some 1000ma drivers to drive it compared ot 3 seperate drivers that have AC input?
well it can turn into a wash...but the main difference usually comes down to dimming protocol.. Most "all in 1" do any one or all of the following : pot dim, 10v PWM or 0(1)-10V.
Few, if any, do 5V PWM.. so some of your choice depends on controller..
There are plenty of "conversion" boards (PWM-10v, ect.) out there but just adds to the expense..
48v is only needed for any future needs.. 36 is fine for any # of Vero18's and any # of drivers in parallel as long as you don't exceed amp draw capability..

Voltage adds in series.. amps add in parallel..
Again LDD-s require a voltage differential so add 3V to whatever the V(f) of your chip is..
Vero 29's and some Luminous devices COBs would require higher than 36V ps w/ LDD's..

LDD's are buck regulators. They will increase (to ps max) or decrease voltage till the amp draw is in line w/ their specification..
Getting larger than necessary voltage only adds a bit to waste..

CORRECTION: Some of the 5V PWM will do 10V PWM....

"A man with a watch knows what time it is. A man with two watches is never sure."

Last edited by jeffkrol; 12-14-2016 at 05:31 PM. Reason: correction
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post #7 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-15-2016, 04:50 AM Thread Starter
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ok talking with O2Surplus on the driver/controller end to see what he has avail that might fit my needs.

just a random thought I had if I go the full blow sunrise/sunset option it might be nice ot have some warm light on another channel.

lets say I go back to the idea of 2 sets of lights 1 5600k 1 2700k split apart 30 inches, giving each about 30 inches to cover, prolly actually would want to cover a bit more to make sure plants that will be growing above the tank a foot or 2 above get full coverage. so 90 degree reflectors 2 ft above the tank should give about a 38inch spread. the leds would then be in a 3 sided box that would block light spill outside the tank to the front and sides of the tank, this box would either be painted white on the inside or lined with say foil for reflectivity to bounce the light to the plants behind the tank.

running the Vero 18 5600k at 1000ma and the vero 18 2700k say 50% would yield 90 watt across the array or around 10-11k lumens (I know lumens aren't the best measure) so i'm thinking enough light

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post #8 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-15-2016, 05:52 AM
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Why not go way "out of the box" and use some dual chips (2 channel ww/cw on board..)
SI-N8B1816E0WW Samsung Semiconductor, Inc. | Optoelectronics | DigiKey

These are 2700/5000k chips but supposedly have some w/ higher cool white..

$16/chip.. 2000 lumens 500mA at 35.5V approx..17.75W each..
Not stocked though..

Doing visible color temp mismatches w/ too much separation gives a "blotchy" rendering.

http://electroiq.com/blog/2016/10/sa...nd-downlights/

"A man with a watch knows what time it is. A man with two watches is never sure."

Last edited by jeffkrol; 12-15-2016 at 05:59 AM. Reason: edit
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post #9 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-15-2016, 06:08 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffkrol View Post
Why not go way "out of the box" and use some dual chips (2 channel ww/cw on board..)
SI-N8B1816E0WW Samsung Semiconductor, Inc. | Optoelectronics | DigiKey

These are 2700/5000k chips but supposedly have some w/ higher cool white..

$16/chip.. 2000 lumens 500mA at 35.5V approx..17.75W each..
Not stocked though..

Doing visible color temp mismatches w/ too much separation gives a "blotchy" rendering.

Samsung introduces LED modules based on chip scale packaging for spotlights and downlights | Solid State Technology
i'll look into that chip, this was a chip I was looking at though which kinda does what your saying as well. 60 watt CREE RGB WW W chip only 1 channel though

[Ebay Link Removed] Cree XP-E Multichip LED 60 Watt Red Green Blue Warm White Light 24-26V 1-2A | eBay[/url]

unclear if the Warm White is the high CRI version Cree makes or not. but I imagine with the RGB it will be fairly well covered spectrum wise.
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post #10 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-15-2016, 06:30 AM
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The Samsung is still a "premium" chip @ $1/watt. Citizens makes one for stage lighting. Even higher cost.. Could be others out there Inc.@ Alibaba. Actually sure they have some Chinese clones.
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post #11 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-15-2016, 06:48 AM
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Note to mods..can't edit post from tablet

Last edited by jeffkrol; 12-15-2016 at 02:12 PM. Reason: edit
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post #12 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-15-2016, 06:56 AM Thread Starter
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I like that option. downside is it would be a pain to drive fairly high Voltage so can't wire them in series. and from what I understand bad to run in parallel. so to get the needed light output I'd prolly need at least 10 drivers prolly more actually since I wouldn't really want to have to have full light on the warm channel just to hit the par level I want.

unless i'm missing something that is
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post #13 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-15-2016, 07:57 AM
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48v PS, 2 LDD's per chip. 39 +3 =42v @250mA x2 LDD's only go down to 300 mA. Not sure if that is a problem or not. Native beam angle is 140 degrees.
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post #14 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-15-2016, 10:16 AM Thread Starter
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while on the topic of alternate leds to look at.

came across these guys

https://blueacro.com/acrostar/

there fresh water 24 watt chip array with there mini driver seems tempting.3x24watts dual channel run by one driver.

anyone mess with these before?
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post #15 of 95 (permalink) Old 12-15-2016, 01:38 PM
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Those arrays are really nice. They're made by a guy called "Theatrus" ( he posts on RC and is a sponsor on the NBR forum). If money's no object, I'd go with a few of the AcroStar Half-Mega Daylight arrays. They'd provide more color temp tunability than two different colored Vero's. Plus those arrays are designed to work with reflectors right out of the box. Makes your build that much easier.
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