210 Gallon of procrastination (its coming together finally after 2 years) - Page 2 - The Planted Tank Forum

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post #16 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-16-2013, 05:36 PM Thread Starter
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Here is plumbing diagram (to be change)
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post #17 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-16-2013, 06:07 PM
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Some real quick notes:
  • 30G is too small, will barely keep up with a power outage. My understanding is sump = 1/3 the size of your display, ideally.
  • If your overflow is designed correctly, you only need to make sure your drains can keep up with the pump flow rate. Depending on pump power, I'd for sure do 1.5" drains for a 220.
  • Your sump doesn't appear to have any filtration? (maybe not drawn?)
  • Look up auto top-off stuff re: refill/drain
  • Your drain system only has two drains - for a tank that size, you'll want a full Beananimal drain system (3) - this is, again, dependant on your flow rates, if high, a single 1.5" drain might not be enough.
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post #18 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-16-2013, 06:11 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazymittens View Post
Some real quick notes:
  • 30G is too small, will barely keep up with a power outage. My understanding is sump = 1/3 the size of your display, ideally.
  • If your overflow is designed correctly, you only need to make sure your drains can keep up with the pump flow rate. Depending on pump power, I'd for sure do 1.5" drains for a 220.
  • Your sump doesn't appear to have any filtration? (maybe not drawn?)
  • Look up auto top-off stuff re: refill/drain
  • Your drain system only has two drains - for a tank that size, you'll want a full Beananimal drain system (3) - this is, again, dependant on your flow rates, if high, a single 1.5" drain might not be enough.
yeah, its going to be full beananimal system, forgot to include all the pipes. I already built the stand, it'll be hard to fit any bigger sump...I can leave the 90G sump in the basement, but the max head is huge, you're talking about 12 ft. Already pre-drill with 1 in bulkheads, but can use 1.5 pvc if that makes a difference. For sump, i was thinking it'll drain down to socks, then run threw eggcrates layer with filter media, etc..., then back to return pump.
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post #19 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-16-2013, 06:29 PM
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Ya, that sump design sounds fine, although my experience with filter socks is they are pretty high maintenance. There are flow rate calculators for weir/overflow drain size/etc, 1" 'should' be ok, but I'd double-check.

I completely sympathize with fitting the sump inside the stand...but I was easily able to fit a 50G under my 125G tank... Go get a cheap used 50 or something at least...doesn't need to be pretty, just needs to hold water. It's the volume you need.

Dunno, maybe I'm way off, but I'd do my darndest to get something bigger.
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post #20 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-16-2013, 07:32 PM
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I agree with crazymittens, your sump is too small. You need to account for the change in volume from when the tank is running to when it's not. Estimating 1 inch of rise in the tank with the pump running, plus what's in the plumbing you're going to have at least 8 gallons running in your system, but not in your reservoir at any given time. That's approximately 1848 cubic inches, or a little more than 12"Lx12"Wx12.75"H inches of water. Meaning, if your reservoir section is 12x12 in area you'll have a drop of almost 13 inches just by turning your pump on. If your pump's in the reservoir you're going to have to have at least 1.5" of water over it at all times to keep it from drawing air. That's a lot of water to have to account for at all times.

If you make your filter section to 12" long (not big enough) that'll leave you with a 24"L x 12"W x 16" H, or 19 gallon MAX volume for a reservoir. Estimate needing to maintain 6" to cover the pump plus another 6.5" to account for water in the system and that leaves you with 3.5", or 4.4 gallons of extra volume. That's hardly anything. Even with an auto top-off you're playing with fire.

How's the stand designed and why can't you fit anything larger than a 30gal in there?

I've never regretted over engineering a system, but often regretted under engineering one.

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post #21 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-16-2013, 07:34 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Edwards View Post
I agree with crazymittens, your sump is too small. You need to account for the change in volume from when the tank is running to when it's not. Estimating 1 inch of rise in the tank with the pump running, plus what's in the plumbing you're going to have at least 8 gallons running in your system, but not in your reservoir at any given time. That's approximately 1848 cubic inches, or a little more than 12"Lx12"Wx12.75"H inches of water. Meaning, if your reservoir section is 12x12 in area you'll have a drop of almost 13 inches just by turning your pump on. If your pump's in the reservoir you're going to have to have at least 1.5" of water over it at all times to keep it from drawing air. That's a lot of water to have to account for at all times.

If you make your filter section to 12" long (not big enough) that'll leave you with a 24"L x 12"W x 16" H, or 19 gallon MAX volume for a reservoir. Estimate needing to maintain 6" to cover the pump plus another 6.5" to account for water in the system and that leaves you with 3.5", or 4.4 gallons of extra volume. That's hardly anything. Even with an auto top-off you're playing with fire.

How's the stand designed and why can't you fit anything larger than a 30gal in there?
i can fit a bigger sump in there, but i originally plan for 30g, I can probably fit up to 60g, the back side is open....but not tall enough for a 90g though.
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post #22 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-16-2013, 08:01 PM
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Ya, what Phil said. You'll be crippling yourself to have only a 30G sump with that size tank. Heck, I had a 30G sump on my 50G.
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post #23 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-16-2013, 10:20 PM Thread Starter
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so this is what i have right now. It seems I will be able to fit the 90g sump in the tank stand if I take out one of the support, then I'll screw it back on.

I will finish up and extend the 2x4 on the floor across and build a 2x4 wall from the opposite side of the concrete wall.
@crazymittens, I check under all 2x4 wall studs, there's no filler or anything underneath. They just nail it to concrete.




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post #24 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-17-2013, 01:07 AM
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I don't get why those 2X4s are touching your subfloor? Any support wall you build should look like this:
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Studs 16" on center and a double top plate. I would also recommend sistering those joists even though you will have to notch those for wires too. Then crossbrace them. Simpson strong ties are helpful for that.

Is your tank going to be running parallel to the joists or across many of them? The framing on your house looks really sturdy and new but I think you've got the right idea to reinforce it.

You might still want to have a professional come out and consult or inspect whatever you end up doing. Also consider what else you might ever want to put in that room (or corner of the house) like a sofa bed, piano, 35 jumping and running 9 year olds...
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post #25 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-17-2013, 01:07 AM
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Oh, just noticed you're in Atlanta...code must be different in your climate. Definitely required here.

I see ram-set cartridges, so you're on the right track. And yeah, you missed the top plate.

Regarding your stand - you might not need the center support if you can utilize this design: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...readid=1169964

You're welcome to read through the thread, but IIRC 2x6 spanning 72" is fine for 125 and 180 gallon tanks - you may need 2x8 for 220. (just the top section)


Definitely do the 90 sump if at all possible!!
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post #26 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-17-2013, 03:11 AM Thread Starter
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thanks guy, i'm taking those 2x4 out tomorrow and adding the top plate. Then I'll put the 2x4 stud back on. Are there any extra plates? I see the diagrm with load, then 2x4 , and top plates. are these the same thing?

@mittens, my stand is overbuilt, it'll be fine.
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post #27 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-17-2013, 11:14 AM
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By extra plates I am guessing you mean 2X4 horizontal cross braces between the studs. Which you could do. You can stagger the heights slightly so you have room to screw through the studs into the ends.

Also I think sistering the joists (the parts called the load in that picture) will serve you well too. Pull out that insulation in those cavities (you can put it back when you are done) and extend them on to the top of your outer wall top plate (or sill plate). Use the longest boards you can fit up into there. You should do this before you finish your support walls.
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post #28 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-17-2013, 01:57 PM
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Sistering (doubling-up) the joists is not a bad idea, but probably overkill for this situation. Not to mention would be a royal pain to do properly due to existing wiring/etc.

Also, horizontal cross-braces = blocking, just in case things weren't confusing enough.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blocking_(construction)

http://www.ehow.com/how_12225739_block-2x4-walls.html
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post #29 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-17-2013, 02:33 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazymittens View Post
Sistering (doubling-up) the joists is not a bad idea, but probably overkill for this situation. Not to mention would be a royal pain to do properly due to existing wiring/etc.

Also, horizontal cross-braces = blocking, just in case things weren't confusing enough.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blocking_(construction)

http://www.ehow.com/how_12225739_block-2x4-walls.html

yeah, there's too much wire, i'll just do the load bearing wall, on the way to home depot again...
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post #30 of 90 (permalink) Old 08-17-2013, 03:56 PM
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Thanks for clearing that up mittens. I should have said blocking.

I'm pretty sure you'll be fine with the two support walls. I'm just into sistering because I've had to do a lot of it around my house which is older than yours.
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