Fe Gluconate - Ugh, nasty precipitate...success! :) - The Planted Tank Forum
 
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-29-2013, 01:50 PM Thread Starter
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Fe Gluconate - Ugh, nasty precipitate...success! :)

I ordered 8 oz. of Ferrous Gluconate and am looking to make a solution for daily dosing, supplementing my EI routine.

I'm confused on the amount to use to get to a 10,000 ppm solution Fe2+, though. The instructions at aquariumfertilizer.com state to "Mix 1/8 cup (about 20 grams) ferrous gluconate to !/4 cup water (250 ml) water to make 10,000 ppm solution Fe2+ " while Tom Barr recommends "36.3 grams per liter to make standard 10,000 ppm solution".

What'd I miss? Looks like Tom's rec. is about half the amount.

Are there different concentrations of Fe Gluconate?

A clumsy calc using wet's site (Fe Gluconate 12.46%) seems like the 20g/250ml will get me ~10,000 ppm:

Quote:
Your addition of 20.0 g Fe Gluconate (12.46%) to your 250.0 mL container, with doses of 250.0 mL to your 0.25 L aquarium adds
Element ppm/degree
Fe 9968.0

Also, can I use Flourish Excel as the liquid to make the solution (since I'm dosing it daily anyway)?

Thanks!

Last edited by Jack Gilvey; 10-09-2013 at 10:40 PM. Reason: title
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-29-2013, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Gilvey View Post
I ordered 8 oz. of Ferrous Gluconate and am looking to make a solution for daily dosing, supplementing my EI routine.

I'm confused on the amount to use to get to a 10,000 ppm solution Fe2+, though. The instructions at aquariumfertilizer.com state to "Mix 1/8 cup (about 20 grams) ferrous gluconate to !/4 cup water (250 ml) water to make 10,000 ppm solution Fe2+ " while Tom Barr recommends "36.3 grams per liter to make standard 10,000 ppm solution".

What'd I miss? Looks like Tom's rec. is about half the amount.

Are there different concentrations of Fe Gluconate?

A clumsy calc using wet's site (Fe Gluconate 12.46%) seems like the 20g/250ml will get me ~10,000 ppm:




Also, can I use Flourish Excel as the liquid to make the solution (since I'm dosing it daily anyway)?

Thanks!
An easy way to do this is to know that 10,000ppm of anything in the universe is equal to 1% of that substance. So, if there is 12.5% elemental iron in iron gluconate then you want to dilute the 12.5% down to 1%. I'm not sure if the powder iron gluconate you're getting is 12.5% active iron gluconate or 12.5% active elemental iron. If it's 12.5% of the iron gluconate then it only contains 1.56% iron (or 15,600ppm iron).

Let me know if you still need help converting into your target solution. I'd need to know what specific volume of the dilution you want (i.e. one gallon, 250mL, 1 quart, etc...).
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-30-2013, 05:40 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jfynyson View Post
An easy way to do this is to know that 10,000ppm of anything in the universe is equal to 1% of that substance. So, if there is 12.5% elemental iron in iron gluconate then you want to dilute the 12.5% down to 1%. I'm not sure if the powder iron gluconate you're getting is 12.5% active iron gluconate or 12.5% active elemental iron. If it's 12.5% of the iron gluconate then it only contains 1.56% iron (or 15,600ppm iron).

Let me know if you still need help converting into your target solution. I'd need to know what specific volume of the dilution you want (i.e. one gallon, 250mL, 1 quart, etc...).
Thank you for the excellent answer! I'm not sure what the 12.46% refers to (just got it from wet's calculator), or if it even refers to all Ferrous Gluconate. Hence my confusion as to amounts.

Just looking for a 10,000 ppm solution Fe2+ (basically Flourish Iron) but am finding the two different recipes above.

I'm also curious about using Excel as the liquid for the solution, would be handy.

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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 09-30-2013, 08:34 PM Thread Starter
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Looks like it's 95g per liter. A bit richer than the 20g/250mL but that's cool.

http://www.barrreport.com/showthread...0-ppm-Solution.

Still curious about using Excel as the liquid.

For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-04-2013, 07:16 PM Thread Starter
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Got my shipment and went to make a solution but am getting what appears to be a nasty precipitate.




I used 7 Tsp (2 1/3 Tbsp) into 250mL, which is lower than the recommended amount, and you can see what's happening no matter how long I stir. It's kind of gummy and smears when pushed against the bottom of the vessel. I tried R/O water and Excel with the same result.

Thoughts? Did I screw something up?

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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-08-2013, 07:19 PM
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It appears to simply be a solubility issue not a precipitate. The powder as I read is slowly soluble in water. So, hot tap water would be the best way to dissolve it. Also whether you use hot or room temp water sift it into the water slowly while mixing. If you simply dumped the powder into water then that's likely the issue.

I always get the tap water as hot as it'll go then fill my glass jar, put on the lid, then swirl to create a vortex. Then I set it down (not to disturb the vortex) then add my EI dosing salts. I re-cap the jar then invert the jar 4-5 times (not shaking it but rather inverting back & forth end over end). Then recreate the vortex and within 30sec my salts are dissolved and that's for my 135gal tank.

Now try the aforementioned dissolution method for your ferrous gluconate but understand that you need to add say a tsp or two at a time. Mix that until it's dissolved then add the next dose into the jar in the vortex. If you do not have a jar then note that a mason jar with a lid or a spaghetti jar with it's lid works great for this.
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-08-2013, 11:38 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks, I'll give it another go!

For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-09-2013, 04:59 AM
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are you using ro/di water for the solution and i also suggest making the solution very acidic before adding the iron to it. Add Ascorbic Acid and Potassium Sorbate to the solution, works very well compare to any other methods i have tried.
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-09-2013, 07:22 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the help! I wound up reducing the amount of Gluc a bit because the idea was to combine with Excel as the liquid and dose two birds with one stone daily. Would have been a high Fe dose for the amount of Excel I use. Knocked it down to 4 tsp into 250mL Excel, added it very slowly, 1/2 tsp at a time, and it worked great.

Thanks again!

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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-10-2013, 06:23 AM
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Hi Jack,

For my benefit, can you please tell me why you're adding more iron? Do you not dose micros or you don't want to do the known ones like Plantex because it has copper?

thanks
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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-10-2013, 06:26 AM
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Because adding a premixed micro fertilizer adds all the other nutrients which can cause toxicities rather easily when you are trying to maintain a high level of iron. High iron can help improve plant colors, and it tends to break down quickly.
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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-10-2013, 12:11 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ipkiss View Post
Hi Jack,

For my benefit, can you please tell me why you're adding more iron? Do you not dose micros or you don't want to do the known ones like Plantex because it has copper?

thanks
I dose Plantex CMS+B bi-weekly as my trace but had read that plants can benefit from not only more iron (and didn't want to just dump more trace in, as Zapins notes) but from other forms of iron in addition to the EDTA Fe in CMS. So I added DTPA Fe to the Plantex as a longer-lasting chelator and decided to dose ferrous gluconate (which is apparently more available to plants but short-lived - it's what's in Flourish Iron) on a daily basis. Since I already dose Excel daily, I mixed in enough FG to get what I wanted (~.2 ppm) in my daily Excel dose.

This is one Tom Barr post I read for the info. Awesome dude. :-)

Ferrous Gluconate

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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-10-2013, 12:15 PM
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cool! thanks! This is one I'll keep in my notes in case I ever notice any iron lacking in my plants over time.
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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-10-2013, 03:17 PM Thread Starter
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I can't honestly say I noticed any deficiencies, as such, in my plants as it's a new low-light setup but I want to come up with a "best-practice" routine that will translate well to the other (possibly high-tech) tanks I have that aren't set up yet.

I do notice that the greens are deeper and the striations on my crypt leaves are more pronounced. Brighter green on my C. Usteriana as well. If I ever add red plants I suspect they'll be, like, really red.

For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
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